I have to put up a wall, parallel to joists. Top plate will not land on joist, and from what I’ve seen, in new construction they put 2×4’s flat between joist so you have something to nail top plate to. I have a bead board ceiling to deal with. I thought of opening from above, that is, remove T&G floor strategically, drop in blocking, and replace floor. Less conspicuous than opening ceiling, cuts in floor will be covered by bed anyway. I think these are my only options, but let me know if there’s another.
Thanks
Kevin
Replies
I would glue and screw the partition to the drywall or beadboard ceiling . I have done that many times. You don't need double plate construction on that partition either. If I was using precut studs, I'd put the double plate on the bottom and that would make it easier to glue and screw the top plate.
Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
there will be some stress on the wall, 2 walls really, it will be on either side of a staircase, there will be a railing attached to the wall.
I don't think you have to worry about the stress of the handrail, especially if the staircase is attached to the finished wall. I assume you want to firm up the staircase which it will do, but attaching the staircase will also tend to firm up the wall as well.
If it is actual beadbaord slats(prolly 1/2-3/4") and you are sure that it is, and will remain, secur. I would feel confident fastening the new top plate securely to that.
Having stairs is different than having slamming doors in the wall. With the beadboard running perpendicular to the wall in question you shouldn't have any side to side movement. Just be sure the beadboard isnt loose at all.
Ok, I was afraid of this happenning. I'll post some pics so you better understand the situation. There is no drywall at all, 120 year old house. Hold off on your answers until I get the pics up, probably tomorrow.
Thanks
Kevin
here are some pics, better explains the situation:
The beams right and left of the staircase will be supported by doubled 2x4's in the wall.
Why is it you cant nail your wall to the joists running along the stair well? It sounds like your enclosing the stairs with two walls right, joists parellel with the stairs. A little explanation with those pics and youll have your answer from somebody.
The biggest problem I see is the stringers are directly under the floor joists.
How were you planning to finish off this detail?
Sorry posted to wrong person<G>
Edited 6/18/2008 9:41 pm ET by frammer52
I thought it looked like the floor joist was doubled in the pic because the ceiling is stagered back so far. If its not I would cut back that ceiling to the depth of the wall slide another joist in there then a nailer for the ceiling (probably a 2x4 on the flat)then build the wall and fasten up into the new stuff. It seems like ive done a lot more with a lot worse situations than this, it dosent seem too bad.
the stringers in the pics are screwed to the notched stringer that were there, I plan on building the walls about about 1/2 way so the last few steps are exposed. Than I'll do railings for the bottom few steps, using the stringer for attachment, or do a bottom rail a few inches above the stringer, like on a porch.
It appears from the picture that the stringer is directly under the above floor joists, that is why asking. if it is not follow Jimallen and Dovetails recomendation.
I just looked again at the photos and believe you are correct. it does appear as if the stringer is in plane with the floor joist above.
This actually makes it easier. Nail the bead board to the stringer, glue and screw the top plate to the beadboard and come back in a few places with a "timberlock" screw and "toe screw" it into the joist.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
yep
Toe nailing the toplate to the joist is what I was thinking. I decided to do it that way this weekend and if the wall is not as stiff as I want it to be, I'll open floor above and drop in blocking, nail to joists and nail toplate to it. Pretty sure I won't have to do that though.
You will be fine as long as you don't have any 300# drunk gorillas using the stairs.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
that would be me helping my brother or him helping me, probably both drunk.
I'm going with my first post. Single plate on top. Glue and nail to the wood ceiling. The stairs is actually a great shear brace. Toe nail each stud securely to that stringer. Glue and nail the bottom plate. Those partition aren't going anywhere. Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
did it exactly as you said, solid as can be. see pics.
Piece O cake!Thanks for the update. Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
In looking at your pictures again--it looks like the beadboard is made of separate boards, maybe t&g? In that case, despite my tending to agree with the two posters who said nailing the studs to the stringers in strong enough, I would consider pulling out three or four of those beadboards and sticking in some blocking between the joists, replacing the beadbaords, then nailing up the wall. How thick are the beadboards? If they are even 3/4 I'd probably just screw and glue the top plate to them and call it good.
beadboard is maybe 3/8" thick. I'm going to open it up and do the blocking. I'll cut with a dremel or jigsaw to mininmize the damage
Doc, it looks like you should be fine just screwing to the beadboard and possibly attaching the wall to the stringers.
Even if you cant put the wall directly to the stringer, you can place a spacer in between the stringer and the wall.
That looks like real beadboard so you certainly have some meat to screw to.
So doc, what's under those walls? Now you see this one-eyed midget
Shouting the word "NOW"
And you say, "For what reason?"
And he says, "How?"
And you say, "What does this mean?"
And he screams back, "You're a cow
Give me some milk
Or else go home"
Don't know, there is some chewed up newspaper in the cieling, too tore up to reassemble. I had planned on replacing the beadboard with drywall and new beadboard but I decided to wait, if at all, so we can use it this summer.
Under the walls, under the house, under the stairs man! Now you see this one-eyed midget
Shouting the word "NOW"
And you say, "For what reason?"
And he says, "How?"
And you say, "What does this mean?"
And he screams back, "You're a cow
Give me some milk
Or else go home"
one whole bottle, white, small. bits and pieces of pottery, glass, stuff like that. I expected to find more.
http://forums.taunton.com/tp-breaktime/messages?msg=105937.23 All done.
Here's another shooting from the hip idea: you could remove a 4" strip of drywall at the ceiling where the top of the wall will be, put boards (as blocking) the right length (should be 14-1/2") up through the 4" by wall length hole and twist them 90* after putting costruction adhesive on their ends, wedging them between joists. To be super duper you could even pre-nail little upright blocks to their ends to give more surface are for the adhesive. (Making the blocks look like squared "U's".)
If you are good with a nail gun, or cordless drill, you could even shoot nails or screws through the ceiling drywall, through the blocking and into the joists, though it's probably not necessary (and you'd have to spackle the holes).
Then screw your top plate to the blocks. Nail or screw you bottom plate to the floor, using a plumb bob to find the exact location. Build your wall--you can frame it on the floor with a bottom and top plate and then just tip it up and slide it between the other top and bottom plates already in place (so it ends up having a double top and bottom plate) or you can toe nail studs in place as you go and not double the plates.
Edit: Oops, I see there is only beadboard ceiling. I thought beadboard over drywall--I guess I would go with the poster who said nail the top plate to the beadboard.
Edited 6/18/2008 9:24 pm ET by Danno
I am with Jim on this one.
I see no problem with glue and screw to hold the wall . Attach studs to the stringers as he suggested and you are good to go.
My question is what is directly above the new wall in the joist space?
I can't ell from the pics if that is a void area and the bead board and flooring above are presently cantilevered past a joist or not.
If is a void as I think it is you will need to slip something in there to support the flooring anyway.