Want to know what you guys think.
Snowed 8 inches yesterday morning (Mon) until about 1 pm , didn’t really think it was in my best interest to go in, made the decision to stay home and attack some estimates,bills and other paperwork that has been accumulating. I am a self employed carpenter who has been trimming and installing kitchens and decks for this builder for a little over a year.
Started this house on Friday with no trim package, just the leftover sticks of trim from the last house, the package is supposed to be delivered this week. Between Fri. and half of Sat. I actually got all the windows done. There are no floors in yet so all the base goes on blocks and then I’ll shoe later, kind of backwards and a pain but do-able.
All in all he’s not really ready but wants to get something done so he can keep moving foward.
I check my messages this morning (Tues) and hear this:
‘As far as I know you don’t work for the f***g goverment or a bank so you better get your f*g a in today !!’ (it was Presidents Day which I’ve never taken off in my life)
I’m really steaming when I hear this, ready to blow a gasket, had a confrontation with him when I get to the job, tell him that he should look for a new trimmer for the rest of his houses, etc. ,etc.
This is the part I can’t understand, according to him he has the right to talk this way because I work FOR him. Although I’m a subcontractor who shows up every day, pay my own taxes and health insurance he insists that I’m on an equal footing as an employee and can be treated as such. According to him I have to do billing and such on my time , What he doesn’t seem to understand it’s all my time, thats why I went into business for myself. WE have to agree to a schedule of work and if that doesn’t coincide then he should get somebody else. He just doesn’t think so, since he signs the checks he should have total control of my scheduling.
Thanks for letting me vent, feel better al ready but was wondering of similar experiences.
Edited 2/22/2005 6:00 pm ET by jaxstraw
Edited 2/22/2005 6:02 pm ET by jaxstraw
Replies
Tell him to FO , then call the IRS and get him a nice audit. He wants the benefit of a sub, but control over you like an employee....I think I'd hit him before I told him to FO.
Wonder if he was standing in front of the HO who was off for the holiday from his banking job and just lit into the GC 'cause nothing was happening that day.
Don't make it right, tho.
Wonder if he was standing in front of the HO Interesting thought. If I was the HO and I heard my gc talkiing to a sub or supplier that way, then we would have a talk about decency and courtesy and manners, and then the gc would call the sub back and apologize.
I'm sorry, I thought you wanted it done the right way.
Atta boy Keith, my feelings exactly.
mike
fine ...
report him to the IRS as an "employer" and let then know he never paid any wage taxes!
btw .... u are 100% right ... he's 100% wrong.
sounds like a good move dropping him too.
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry in Carpentry
Pgh, PA
ask him if he would like to discuss your "working for him" with the IRS?
they'ed love to collect more taxes from him, as would workmans comp, and maybe couple others
bobl Volo, non valeo
Baloney detecter
I would ask this spunk monkey where his half of your SS and unemployment is. Also, can he provide you with proof of WC coverage since you work " FOR" him.
After that I would walk. And, when he comes begging you to come finish the job, the price would be 50% more.
A few different ways to look at this:'
Legally--he's got nothing. You are independently operating, and can set your own hours. You could take a vacation or work in timbuktu, especially if you've got his job on schedule.
Straight up business--you could let him yell. Ask him if he's done yet, and then tell him he doesn't get materials on time, affecting how you can work his job. Or just yell back. Some of these guys need to be really slammed hard back to take them down a notch.
Or just suck it up. Decide how much his work means to you and either take it or move on. I'd say the next time you have a choice between working with someone else and this guy he could lose.
No matter what, I'd make it clear that considering the weather and the fact that you worked on the weekend and are more than caught up to his material delivery that he can suck it. And that he better keep the material and work flowing so you can stay on the job or you'll bite his head off next time.
I hate this kind of abusive relationship. Good luck,
Dog
Had a similar incident last week,he did'nt cuss us though. Framing a house for this 'small'builder,floor is down ready for walls. 1st floor framing package is there with the exception of the 10ft 2x6 studs. We piddle around making headers,chalk lineing the floor,etc. Next morning still no material. We go back to our last house to do punch-out. He hunted us down,demanding to know why we were'nt working on his house.
Told him to cuss the lumber guy,not us...we've got nothing to do. Things got worse after that. Next morning,truck arrives[boom truck] and starts unloading. One of the hydraulic fittings broke, which dropped the load and we watched as this guy literally emptied the hyd. tank ...spraying everything. It looked like a fire truck spraying that s..t.
Back on the phone with builder. "Come look at this...half your lumber is soaked with hyd.fluid and we are'nt touching it". "Get us some new or we pull off again". The cards were in our favor, especially after a comment was made about calling the EPA.
I didn't do it....the buck does NOT stop here.
Oh yeah almost forgot,
Anyone who left a message with that tone to it would most likely trip and fall in a dark alley sometime. probably lose a few teeth.
That was too dam funny............
Lottsa good answers here though.
EricI Love A Hand That Meets My Own,
With A Hold That Causes Some Sensation.
[email protected]
Eric,
The world is full of guys like this clown. They all think they can just talk to and treat people however they see fit. In my fathers time they would have gotten a beatdown and that would have changed their attitude.
Today the same loudmouth little sissy would be the first one to call the cops. He knows he can treat his employees and subs however he feels like treating them and nothing will happen to him. And that is the problem. A little private pain and they suddenly get a new attitude and it's much nicer than the old one.
About three or so years ago a bunch of us were in the motorpool. The Master gunner was going from tank to tank checking on the crews as they were doing the live fire prereq's. ONe particular tank commander was treating his crew, and the crew of the tank next to his like total dog $###. He had a bad attitude and every crew he ever had self destructed because of it. The Master gunner warned him that he better change his attitude and treat them with some respect or they were gonna have a problem. Half hour later, same nonsense. He warned him, told him he was gonna come throw him off of the turret if he didn't stop. It went something like " You won't dare lay a hand on me". Which was followed by the Mike Golf Climbing the front slope onto the turret and throwing this guy off of the top of an M1A1 tank. Litterally throwing him off. That cycle his crew went on to shoot top gun. instead of belittling them he had to actually teach and mentor them for fear that the Mike Golf would beat his a$$ again.
For some people a little pain and humiliation goes a long way.
I've been thinking this thread over in my mind. All - and I mean every dang one of them - of the people I have ever known who act like this jerk have had themselves in financial situations where the bank or somebody was pressuring THEM. They are low enough to turn around and put it off onto somebody else like this. The guy here may have already told the bank that the trim was finished and put in for a draw or some such thing.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Piffin, you are right. I experienced that this past summer. An old and very valued client lost it one day. The job was 3 months late getting started and I told him I would have to fit him in since I technically didn't do installations anymore and one day he lost it on the phone after money tightened up and he ceased to become a priority. When clients are not paying the other trades it is time to be cautious with what you outlay.
Long story short, I billed, he paid me half and wondered why I hadn't gotten around to doing the next phase. Knowing the painter and the other guys had only seen 1/3 of their bills told me something wasn't kosher.
He went nuclear on the phone something horrible. I was the only one to get paid and had to get creative on him to do it. When I picked up the check at the office the signs were stripped, the office was attrocious. Couple of $20.00 desks and the whole thing reeked of bankruptcy. Obviously he was renovating the houses to hide money, and bankrupting the business. Just glad I got out when I did.
Another abusive client, related to Harold Ballard decided she would have at me one day. Seems she was used to ruling over slaves due to her station in life. She had no idea I was only on the site helping a friend out. She lit into me and I calmly told my helper to load the tools in the truck.
She went insane. I calmly went downstairs and told my friend, sorry, we're working hourly here... she's rude and if she wants us here tomorrow the price per hour just doubled.
I can still hear her saying-"You just don't understand...", No maam, you just don't understand. Slaves have to be purchased, fed, housed and clothed. You have done none of that. Good day maam.
Life is too short to deal with jerks. Find new work and walk. If the guy doesn't pay you tell him you are writing to the IRS for a ruling on whether or not you were an employee. You'll get paid pronto. you are in control now friend.
L
GardenStructure.com~Build for the Art of it!
Piffin,
I think you nailed that one. The thing that always bothered me is why didn't the guy just come clean? If a GC or builder provided the bulk of my work and just told me he was in a tight spot i would probably bend over backwards to help him out.
I miss the work but i sure don't miss the business.
wow piffin, you nailed it perfectly______________________________________________
--> measure once / scribble several lines / spend some time figuring out wich scribble / cut the wrong line / get mad
on your way ot the door take a chunck of him with ya...
teach him some manners and clue him to the way things are...
back charge the snot out of for good measure...
a boss like him with his attitude would never survive civil rights court..
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Keith and Jeff nailed it already. F#ck him. Even if you were his employee, he has no right to talk to you that way.... that alone is justification for a busted nose.
'Course violence is just gonna cause you more problems, so forget that little tidbit of advice. Seriously though, you are not his employee and he has doesn't have any say in the hours you keep or your comings and goings in general. Call and let him know that since you "work FOR him" you'll be letting the IRS know of his back employer taxes and your missing overtime pay. See how sharp his toungue is after that conversation.
What a dink. Good on ya for not taking that kinda crap.
>> 'Course violence is just gonna cause you more problems, so forget that little tidbit of advice.But if you are thinking about hitting him, make sure you hit hard enough to put him down. No sense at all in just pissing him off.
jax... u no what i would tell him ?
c'mon..... everyone .. all together now..
u no what i'm going to say
on the count of 3
1 ( take a deep breath )
2 (let a little of it out )
3.........
BITE ME
Slow as I am tonight......saw that one coming a MILE away!
I must be losing my memory or something.... I actually had to stop and think what it was that you were going to say!
In real life, do you have a good growl that goes along with the
BITE ME ?I'm thankful for the loyal opposition! It's hard to learn much from those who simply agree with you.
I'd not do , or say, anything...just show him my tail lights..there are a lot better ways to get an azz reamen that are a LOT more fun..
Circleing around for a full frontal assault is unwise, unless got him dead on something...just book out..take yer pride..It takes more guts to refuse a parry than to instigate one.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Restoring, Remodeling, Reclaiming The Quality..
Do you really need this guy? If not, take it down the road. I've had bosses talk to me that way and I've talked to employees that way but only when we were looking at one another and laughing. I can't think of any other context where I would put up with that - or expect anyone else to.
Another good fix would be to rip out what you had done. pile it in the garage and tell him he doesn't owe you a thing and adios!
you guys got me crackin up!
This a hole of a "GC" is probably worth a mint too.
I say we all go over there and ruff'm up a bit!!!!
Imagine how much money he could have made treating people nicely and fairly.
I don't understand how people like this are successful. i know a "GC" exactly like this a hole.
If I killed him tomorrow, ten people might mourn him, but 25 would thank me and shake my hand.
I feel sorry for his wife and kids.
EricI Love A Hand That Meets My Own,
With A Hold That Causes Some Sensation.
[email protected]
jac,
I did the same thing you did on Monday for the same reason. The whole world is at risk when I drive my van in the snow, its like trying to stop a locomotive. (when I have work), I only take Sundays.
In retrospect though, I did call the client and let them know, just out of respect.
I think a big issue that no one has pointed out, is that it was on a machine. I would be mortified that someone else might get the message. Its not their problem, they shouldnt be subject to that, or the abuse they may indirectly feel with their relationship with you, or their sensitivities about someone talking to you like that.
If overall your relationship has been good, I have to say its pure transference. He is feeling the pressure of the deadline. Thats NO excuse, and transference isnt reasonable behavior for anyone.
I wouldnt fight, Id just pack up and play the disappointed in him role, you wont teach him anything, hes to old to listen. Keep moving forward, he will take enough of a hit without you.
-zen
I like that a lot!
This guy sounds like an A #1 A-hole. Nobody deserves that. Not employees, not subs, no one.
Did you really walk away? I hope you did.
I would start off with l;etting him kniow that anyone who leaves a filthy potty mouthed message on a machine like he did is a friggin' coward - to his face.
Then I'd let him know that I don't work FOR anybody, especially people who are so low as to behave like that.
Then, I'd pick up my tools and go.
Welcome to the
Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
This guy paying you hourly? Piecework? Whole job?
You write him invoices?
Has your total revenue from this guy exceeded $3,000 in any years you've been doing business?
Does he 1099 you?
Does he have any direct-pay hourly employees?
The big question is, if he runs you off, or if you walk out on him, can he readily find someone like you as a replacement?
From the other side...
When I have guys like plumbers and electricians or whatever lined up, I expect them to show up, or call as far in advance as possible and let me know, so I can reschedule the whole chain, if needed.
Second, I think that it's reasonable to expect people to be late or have difficulty regarding issues like weather, but again, a call is helpful.
That said, it seems like the first really doesn''t apply as your work seemed to be ahead of, or at least on schedule.
And the second, well it sort of applies, even if your being there casued no effect on others.
Still.... a call goes a long way.
OK, that said, his message (a machine, not voice mail???) is completely unprofessional, and WAY OUT OF LINE, if the facts are as you presented. And even if they are not, no excuse. If I were you, it would worry me that he is such a hot head. Will he fire you because his dog took a dump in his truck? Or will he not pay you because ...whatever?
Bottom line? It depends on your agreement, really. If you said you'd be there every day from X to Y hours, then you might want to adjust your agreement or your methods. But if you said you'd be there when you felt it was appropriate, then tough cookies on him.
When people ask why I work late sometimes, and I reply, "It's my job", they look at me funny..until I remind them that my boss isn't me, it's the client. And if my agreement with my client is to hit a certain deadline, I do my best to make it happen.
In this case your "client" is the guy signing your check, and if he is being a jerk, there are plenty others that are likely more respectful.
If it were me, and I felt I was in the right, and I had been clear and upfront with my explanation of my operation, and I had enough work to keep going, I would inform he he should find someone who is a bgger #### kisser, and walk right away.
If I didn't have enough work, and needed the job to eat, I would be hating life, and would probably inform him that if he ever left any such message or wasn't respectful and professional in any way in the future, that I would walk immediately.
I would also make sure I was up to date $-wise before either discussion!
Jake Gulick
[email protected]
CarriageHouse Design
Black Rock, CT
You are right, I may have read into that, the original post didnt state voice mail or answering machine.
-zen
he's there to trim a whole house.
a day one way or another ain't gonna make anyone wait.
I've worked around idiots like that guy ...
I give an aprox start date .. and an aprox finish date ...
everything in between is mine ... not his.
If I wanna come in and do a months worth of trim in the last 8 hrs ...
as long as it's finished before those 8 hrs are up ...
too bad for him.
the first mistake was to go kill time waiting for the full trim package.
I sub tile, trim and cab installs.
either all my stuff is there and ready ... as well as the work space being ready for me ... or I don't unload any tools. Learned that part well from my HVAC guy ...
he only unloads a clipboard at first ... if "just gotta frame one more wall .. U start over there" happens ... U end up at the bottom of his list. We both subbed for the same people for a while ... glad I learned from someone smarter than me.
Subs get paid for working ... not waiting.
they also decide where and when a snow day is.
Jeff Buck Construction
Artistry in Carpentry
Pgh, PA
Here's how I would look at this: The GC was disrespectful and completely out of line to leave you a message like that. Agreed. But it didn't cost you any money, or cause you physical harm. How you choose to respond to it is entirely up to you. I used to work with a guy who said, "I cannot control another person's actions...I can only control my reaction." Your choices include all of the things suggested here, and then some. You could have cursed back at him, punched him, reported him to the IRS, walked off the job, any number of things. Or you could do like Luka (I think) suggested. Nothing. Show him your tail lights, and nothing more. Or, if you like working for the guy, talk to him. I guess you've already quit, but a five minute talk could settle this whole thing. He just needs to be told, in a calm voice, that the message he left you is unacceptable, and if it ever happens again, there'll be no more work for him by you. And you need to establish the fact that you are NOT an employee, and that should be easy to do. The older I get, the less likely I am to fire an idiot up like I would have when I was younger. I've found out that if you conduct yourself in a respectful way with other people, they will usually treat you respectfully, even if it isn't something they usually do. The ones that don't, I have very little time for, but no longer feel the need to drop to their level to deal with them. I went to work for a guy last summer, and the second day on the job, he yelled at the only other guy he had working for him. The guy quit, right then. The boss came over to me and made a comment about the guy quitting. Here's what I said, as well as I can remember it: "Dave, I'll tell you something right now. If you ever talk to me the way you just did that man, I'll do exactly what he did. I wouldn't tolerate that kind of bullsh*t for one minute, and I doubt you would, either."
I turned around and went back to work, and I swear, I worked for him for about 6 months, and he never raised his voice to me. He would even mention that if he said anything that I thought was out of line, to let him know. And it turns out he has the worst reputation in town for being a screamer! No one could believe I worked for him that long, and no one could believe he NEVER yelled at me.Allen in Santa Cruz
Edited 2/23/2005 12:42 am ET by moondance
I believe that no true gentleman would ever take advantage of me. If someone I thought was a gentleman took advantage of me, then I would cease doing business with him immediately.
My time and stress level is already stretched thin enough.
Eight inches of snow and this jerk wonders why you aint there? Definately walk away from this SOB.
If by chance he ever reels you in to take on another job for him, definately do what Robert mentioned...charge him out the a*s and insist on being paid in full up front.
Remember the ole saying...Payback's a bitch.....and in this suckers small little mind, when you walked, he figures he owes you one...so if you ever again deal with him... make sure you hold all the cards!
Davo
http://www.peakconsultinginc.com/Articles/employee_vs_independent_contract.htm
The awful thing is that beauty is mysterious as well as terrible. God and the devil are fighting there, and the battlefield is the heart of man.
- Fyodor Dostoyevski
Jax, your sad situation has prompted many responses. The only one's I'm inclined to agree with are those that deal with the abuse issue. You haven't detailed enough business info to make a qualified business opinion.
I agree with Allen's response the most. Since no one in this world is perfect, occasionally we all behave in socially unacceptable ways. When we are witness's or parties to the abuse, we have a variety of response ranging from packing up to fighting. You could make a good case for either type of response, but the real decision is up to you, based on your ability to roll with the punches...but...the very least that you need to do is stand up for yourself and demand respect. Don't ever let anyone talk down to you, or use language like that. If the GC can't immediatly agree to your civil request, then it's best to start negotiaing for your severance payment, if any is due. In this case, since you didn't have much invested, I'd probably just invoice for hours and file a lien if he didn't pay. If he immediatly changed his tone, then accept the apology and find out what the real problem is and work together to move forward profitably.
All of my advice depends on the overall relative working condidtions. You said you've had gainful work for a year, so I'm offering my words based on that. Beware however, that working steadily for the same builder on a continuing basis makes you very vulnerable, both in terms of finances and emotionally.
blue
Just because you can, doesn't mean you should!
Warning! Be cautious when taking any framing advice from me. There are some in here who think I'm a hackmeister...they might be right! Of course, they might be wrong too!
I know a remodeler in Vail, Colorado. More than a couple of inches of snow there and its a "powder day". Those days are for skiing, and the client better learn to accept that!Bear
Thanks for all the input.
Went in today (weds) to either finish,confront peaceably, or reach a settlement of some sort.
The house is locked and there's no key, Spanish tile guys standing outside waiting to get in, I waited for an hour and a half, no answer on his cell or office line.
Called the trim package supplier (I've known him for years) , this jerk owes them 30k and they haven't even placed the order until he settles up!! So that's not coming.
You know, if he was honest and had a problem I probaly would have worked with him to an extent, but between the phone call (voice mail) and the run around that's going to be it. I'm into him for about 2k and will work that out instead of walking away from it. That's it for him though.
Came back home and am in the process of tracking down new leads, got two finish trim offers working for somebody else through the paper and the hardwood floor installer has got another builder with a sub-division looking for a trimmer, he's calling tonite.
Glad to see most everyone agree's with me, thanks guys.
Hey Jax, what is the closest major center near you? Not near Stanton Island are you?
L
GardenStructure.com~Build for the Art of it!
I live right outside of Kingston NY in a 150 yr old Methodist Church, lease is up in Sept. and landlord is moving back in.
Most of my work now is in Dutchess County (Poughkeepsie is the largest center) although I'm from Yorktown Heights in Westchester County.
Got a lot of great experience doing what I do on those huge homes down that way, quite a bit in Greenwich Conn also.
Economics forces me farther and farther north although I can't say I don't like it.
jax.. when my brother was living in Newtown, CT.. we used to play a lot of golf at James Baird State Park..
that's right around your neck of the woods, right ?Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Baird is about 5 miles up the Taconic Parkway from this subdivision and across the river from where I live.
It's booming around here with all the folks heading north, probaly a lot different from when you remember it.
Tons and tons of 4000 sq.ft. homes all over. The place everyone talks about is Silo Ridge over in Pawling. All my friends who hit the links go there.
There's a big subdivision called The Legends built around a course in Beekman. 250+ homes built through and around the course.
"this jerk owes them 30k and they haven't even placed the order until he settles up!!"DID i CALL THIS ONE ON THE NOSE OR WHAT?!Now just let me learn to pick stocks on Wall street this well and I'll throw you guys a party!
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
You da man!!!!!!
Again!
Luke 6:43 "The good man brings good things out of the good stored up in his heart,
the evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in his heart.
For out of the overflow of his heart his mouth speaks."
After playing your obscene message on my business speaker phone for my whole family to here I've decided you need help..............but not mine.
"Rather be a hammer than a nail"
Bob
One thing I haven't seen:
You have his obscenities recorded. Such abuse is a Federal Crime. I have just three more words: Eff Cee Cee.
Best Regards,
Don
You should have called him back and told him the voices told you to stay home that day, and clean your guns...
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
Don't you have a winch to work on?
Put the guns down!
EricI Love A Hand That Meets My Own,
With A Hold That Causes Some Sensation.
[email protected]
The guns are to guard the winch from the dirty lowdown arsewipes who have been stealing things from me.; )
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
jeff, I realize that this gets into another subject, but since you brought it up...And maybe this is not one that you can adapt to your situation...But there is a astory here about a guy who kept finding that his firewood pile was shrinking. He didn't know which of his neighbors was helping themselves to his warm nature, but he decided to find out - and do something preventive at the same time.
He drilled out a spot in a chunk or two of wood and filled it with an M-80, then a plug to cover things over. Thieves in the dark of night don't look things over too well.About a week later, several guys were gathered at the home of one of his neighbors for poker in th ekitchen, near a round pot belly type of stove which heated the place pretty well.Amidst the sudden loud noise, the lid flew up on the stove to hit the ceiling, the door jumped open and a couple cinders jumped out. Everyone around the table was still and suddenly sober. Old Gussie spoke with his customary lisp as he reached over for his jacket, "Well Bouys, Time to head home early tonight, I expect" The place erupted in laughter at that stoic comment. The firewood thefts came to an end though.Got a five gallon can of gas you could add sugar too?
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Strange that you think of that.The one thing of that type that I have considered doing is to fill a 2 1/2 gallon can mostly with piss, and then add enough gas to keep the smell correct.One of the neighbors that I KNOW has been stealing, has also tried to steal gas from me several times. Only got the gas once. I discovered it, and got a locking gas cap.Anyway, I am figuring if I put that where it can be seen, it'll walk off soon enough.And with all that piss going through the works on their car, they are going to be walking pretty soon, too. LOL
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
Diesel will do wonders for a fuel injected gas motor... but if they are a pro the'll be able to tell from taste and smell.
L
GardenStructure.com~Build for the Art of it!
But a gallon of diesel diluted in ten to twenty gallons of gas ?Besides, it probably wouldn't do much to a carburated engine, and there is no way these people would have anything new enough not to be carburated.
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
when somebody starts to steal yur diesel...
tart useing the tank as a holding tank or paint thinner. old lac, gas, and a host of other garbage by products...
let 'em steal it and see if they can go a week without a melt down...
kill two birds with one tone...
you get rid of some serious by-products and you put a stop to the tealing....
make it some very expensive fuelll so much fer his bargin...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
I don't use diesel.Lawtence just suggested that I put diesel in the can, instead of regular gas.
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
I know.. that's how I fixed my fuel theft problem...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
What about being neighborly and filling that gas can again but throw in a few egg whites? When they warm up that can't be good for the injectors, fuel filter, etc.
In a pinch egg whites will fix minor leaks in a radiator once they warm up.
Edited 2/24/2005 4:54 pm ET by DDay
Egg whites !!Now that is one that I hadn't thought of. That would take even a carburator out...I wonder what egg whites would look like in the can after a few days ?Or if they would even retain their "properties" when put into gasoline and left there for days...
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
Re: Gas thefts
At home the popular solution was about 2 cups of bleach in a 5 gallon can of gas. The bleach breaks down the oil in the motor and after about 10 minutes of driving, you have a nice solid piece of metal where the motor used to be.
Old farmer's remedy. Just make sure you know which can you put it in.
mark macleod
Just write premium only on the can so you don't forget and when they come to steal it they can't resist.
ANDYSZ2I MAY DISAGREE WITH WHAT YOUR SAYING BUT I WILL DEFEND TO THE DEATH YOUR RIGHT TO SAY IT.
Remodeler/Punchout
Fill half the can with water. The gas will stay on top. Every time their gas gets low, the car will stop. It won't hurt anything, so you won't be damaging anybody's engine.
Remember, as you always say, the person you offend today, may be your best friend tomorrow!
This guy has already stolen gas from my truck once, and tried several times more. He has also stolen two other gas cans that had gas in them.If he steals this, he is stealing the damage to his own vehicle. He doesn't have to steal it. It is wrong for him to steal it. If he does so, I will for once, feel no remorse for such a thing.As for making friends... I am not going to go into a bunch of detail. But... Been there, done that, and I don't like the tee shirt.When they didn't know me they stayed off the property because they didn't know what I would do in retaliation.Once I "became friends" with them, they used and abused the friendship, and started stealing from me behind my back. That's when they weren't busy defrauding me, and stealing from me, to my face.I neither need nor want "friendships" with these people any more. They have no desire to ever be anything other than drug addicts and thieves. They will even steal from each other, and/or sell each other out, for more drugs.No Thanks.
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
BTW Zig,It's not like I made some half-hearted attempt here. If you knew me, you'd know I didn't just give them second chances, I gave them second hundred chances...Every single time, it comes down to being ripped off or used in some way.Screw it. I have helped them out when they came, needing help. I have gone to their houses and helped them. I have worked with them. Etc. I tried for more than three years. Figured if they knew me, they'd leave me alone, knowing that I don't have much, and what I have is precious because I can't just go out and buy something to replace it.That means nothing to them. All they care about is how much they can get out of you, or can get from your stuff, so they can get more drugs.Like I said, screw it.
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
They sound like meth users. Maybe they'll burn their house down.
They ARE meth users.And cookers.And I am afraid they will not only burn their house down, but also the forest... Including the forest around my house, and that would take my place out as well...
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
Luka, you must live in the American equivalent to Elmvale Ontario.
Being the coldest spot in Ontario, smart people shipped out long ago, all that's left is the low lifes.
They gang up in the school yard and beat up my kids in groups of 30, then the whole town defends the perps. Cops won't even do a press release when kids get charged.
Principal lets the kids back in school in 2 weeks.
Anything left out front gets stolen. I have video on the shop inside and out.
People steal tools that were working for me... got one on video taking about $5000, cops still won't do anything. (glad I don't own a bank)
Hired about 10 people on in the first 6 months of the video-once viewing the video it quickly became apparent why work was not getting done. Fired them all in the first week they started. You leave, they all sit down. They all wanted top dollar to sit and smoke for 50% of the time. Not kidding.
I have a 2500 sq. ft shop sitting empty because there's no one to work it. I sub out any fabrication for kits to my old right hand man who has set up a shop about 45 mins away-no problem getting labor there, but I don't have time to babysit. I have sold most of the big tools to grow the other side of the business and won't set up another shop until head office moves.
Tried to get vehicles fixed locally-not rocket science. Paid 300 for a carb gasket, wondered why it lasted 2 weeks and leaked again. When I pulled it apart found it was a folded over cigarette package. Believe it.
The other shop... tried to find a fuel problem on the 83 ford. After $500.00 diagnostic (yes, they charged me for their incompetance), they couldn't find it. Sent it to my regular shop 1/2 hour away... $80.00 ripped hose above the gas tank, 2 hours, done.
Sorry for the book.
Just got off the phone with the local superintendent of schools... Just Raging a bit...
I have 2 days into this clown, Wife has 3 so far. Would love to see his face when he discovers what I'm up to.
Art Of War-works well for interpersonal conflicts especially for inept burocracies.
L
GardenStructure.com~Build for the Art of it!
lawrence.... my , my.. we are wrapped a little tight today , no ?
hope the venting helped.. it's the least we can do here is give each other a sounding board
and .. the obvious question .. when are you moving ?Mike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Not soon enough Mike, Have to ride the line between building a company and finishing this money pit. Property values have about tripled and we've done a lot of work to this place.- Down to a few windows, floors, trim and siding... then we're gone-back nearer my friends and a warmer climate.
"All better now- thanks guys"
L
GardenStructure.com~Build for the Art of it!
L ...
on a side note ...
30 kids against your one ...
I have an older brother ... coupla years older ...
growing up ... we ran into one case where an older kid was bully-ing me ... but my brother was "too old" to jump in ... his fix ... drive in a "hired gun" from a coupla towns away.
I was 9 ... my bully was 14 ... greg was 16. Obviously ... a 16 year old can't beat a 14 year old into a coma w/o jail time ... but ... another 14 year old can! He was driving ... and had friends "out of town" ... U know ... 15 min and a life time away.
One day ... on the scheduled "beating by the bully day" ... he pulls up in his van (yup, my 16yr old brother drove his own restored van!) ... and the biggest 14 year old monster I ever saw came out ..... beat the snot out of my bully ... the whole time my older brother was standing there saying ... You, yer right ... I can't hit ya ...
Organize ... delegate. These are skills U already have.
btw ... 5 years was alot to give up when I was 9 .... I caught up with the same guy when I was 19 and bartending in our same small town.
Find an "older buddy" for your kid ... my advice ... look for one that's standing on some corner by himself ... leather jacket/blakc tee shirt ... probably smoking .... trust me ... he hates the rest of the town too. Coupla CD's or a pack of smokes ... he'll be into it for the principle of the thing.(Or ... a kid from "one town over" ... they hate yer town too")
Jeff
I alread knew how to fight ... my brother beat me up daily ... plus ... by 9 ... I had 2 years of karate and was a ... yellow belt, at least ... other kid was just too damn big. I never ran ... always stood my gound and fought back best I could ... but that other kid was just too damn big ... not knowing the circumstances ... your kid just might need a hand with one or two main bully's ... the rest will fall into place.
now that I'm thinking about this ... I gotta ask my folks if they remember ... and just what the hell they were thinking! They'll probably say there were keeping tabs and knew me and Greg would work it out before I got killed ... I never came home any more beat up than usual(kid stuff bullying) ... wonder if this one slipped under the radar? Buck Construction
Artistry in Carpentry
Pgh, PA
I agree Jeff, trouble is this kid is not a tough guy. He's artistic, a writer, plays yugio and doesn't bother anyone. He's petrified of me because I was a bully trap. He's reasonably strong but doesn't have the killer instinct-though I really would have loved to see him do some damage to at least 1 or two of the bullies.
After 2 years of karate and doing hard heavy labour I was 140 lbs and could lift a 200lb man up by the shirt at 14. Our club had a lbs/sq" meter. I was punching about 320lbs at that age. Being a little guy there was always an idiot thinking they could shove me around. Could tell you some interesting stories, but needless to say my bullied years lasted about 3 months-and most of the battles I was involved in were defending someone else.
Alas, today is a different time. Zero tolerance is now the rule. You simply can't get away with hurting anyone whether it is a deterring first strike or not, and most certainly not in an elementary school yard where this event happened.
The jarring thing that happened was that when having a frank discussion with the Superintendent the guy overtalked me and bullied me on the phone. Couldn't believe it. Akin to going to the principals office to report getting hit and having the principal slap you around and call you Susan. Needless to say, this doesn't impress me.
My Humble Opinion-he shouldn't be there, not just because he is a bully, but because he's not doing his job. He has fed me all the information I need and now, he's going to have the most excruciating couple of years of his life.
You are right about hurting the bully bad enough that they are afraid to come back at you. The great part of that theory is that they tell all their friends and noone messes with you. Grade school was a nightmare for me, but high school was a breeze-and this is the first time I have ever been bullied in about 20 years.
You simply can't lay down for it. My kid is reading every word of how I am doing this, watching the days of preparation and finally taking action. He's learning that bullying is wrong-and there is always someone much more capable than you. Most importantly my kid is learning that you can deal with bullies using intellect far more efficiently than with your fists-98% of the time.
Hit someone with your fist-they hurt for a day or so, they might be embarassed-but it normally won't prevent them from doing it again.
Hit someone with something that turns their world upside down and they spend the next 20 years trying to figure out how and why it happened to them. I'll be sure to send him an anonymous note after it's all done, just so he knows for sure.
LGardenStructure.com~Build for the Art of it!
Sounds just like home.; )Actually, I think in time, we will see things improve around here.Now that others are being ripped off to the tune of really big dollars, the other members of the community are finally starting to do something about it.Just as the arsewipes do not like lights and noise when they are doing the deed... They don't like the "lights and noise" of a community that is aware of them, and watching. Some have already moved out and not come back.Very few of those people are actually landowners.
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
First, dont erase the tape. Save it to another device. Then call his answer machine, play the tape back to him and let him know that now you own him!
Man !
I have really hijacked your thread.
I'm sorry.
If this goes on, I'll go start another thread.
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
Still on the generall subject - don't get mad, get even
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
It's cool ,thread kind of petered out on it's own.
Enjoy.
: )The hijack probably has as well.I don't really have anything more to add to it. LOL
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
I didn't read what anybody said, but someone or some people should be kicked in the nuts for that!
ROFLOLDone that to them many times already in my imagination...; )
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
You have an interesting fantasy life.;)
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Yer telling me that if someone stole your 4 inch grinder and a bunch of other tools, you wouldn't fantasize about kicking them in the balls ?Maybe breaking a leg or two...; )
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
You don't know my four inch grinder.But if it were my new Makita CMS, I might throw in a few broken teeth
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
ROFLOL
The person you offend today, may have been your best friend tomorrow
jaxstraw,
I'd suggest maintaining the high road, this way you'll have a clear conscience. I don't think you should plan on working for this guy long term if he treats people this way. If that's true, either quit immediately or start looking for another job and do your best to tolerate him. If for some reason you think there's a future for you here, tell him you need to talk about his unnacceptable treatment.
Good Luck