GFCI Issue….Just curious??? (long)
Good Morning All,
Just yesterday I ran into an issue with the GFCI outlets upstairs at the homestead. Were I more electrically inclined I would have fixed it by now and moved on to something else. Following below are a brief explanation and some questions. I have no intention of fixing this my self, just curious.
Assuming that the three bathrooms outlets are all on the same GFCI loop The downstairs bathrooms outlet does not work at all. The upstairs bathroom on this end of the house is stacked and when I plugged a vacuum into this outlet the other day, the motor got a small ‘bump’ then nothing. This also caused the outlet in the master that has the tester to not supply electricity as well. Since the master bath outlet is the one with the tester in it we will assume that this is the first device in line from the panel?? The upstairs bath would be next and then the downstairs.
Deveices that are consistently used in the bathrooms are as follows;
1. Master bath is wifeys hair dryer and curling iron, never much more than that.
2. Upstairs bath outlets near sink rarely get used by the girls.
3. Downstairs bath has an electrically operated smell good thingy and a glow light 24/7.
Note that the second outlet in the master has worked continuously and all other GFCI outlets are in proper working order. Since the outlet upstairs ‘arcs’ out when a load is applied any suggestions as to cause?? Any suggetsions as to new tools that might help me identify the problem before I call a sparky.
Thanks in advance for your consideration.
Best Regards
Replies
If outlets are all on the same GFCI they should all work or none of them work. The one that never works likely has a bad connection.
Reset the GFCI in the master bath and try plugging some other device (eg, a hair dryer) into the outlet in the upstairs bath. If that causes the GFCI to trip then there is a wiring error between the upstairs bath and the master bath. (If there is indeed a wiring error causing this problem then it could be another wiring error causing the downstairs problem.)
Where wiring errors and GFCIs are concerned you really need someone who understands wiring and electrical stuff (including GFCIs) to sort it out.
If the hairdryer does't cause a trip but the vacuum does, I'd check the vacuum for internal leakage (a partial short to the case). Occasionally, though, a large motor can cause GFCIs to trip.
Thanks for you response. The truly curious issue is that the outlet in the upstairs bathroom did eventually 'reset' itself??? This was confirmed by the a glow light. I'll be calling a sparky on Monday.
Appliances that generate a lot of electrical "noise", such as motors,
tend to pop GFI's, especially those that are nearing the end of their service life. I'd replace the master CGFI, and would not, in the future, plug a vacuum into a CGFI.
Your post was confusing re the meaning of "stacked" outlets (???). If the CGFI is popped none of the bathroom outlets should have power.
-- Brooks
Thanks for your response. I will remember tha nono re vacuums and GFCI's. By 'stacked' I meant stacked construction where the baths are one on top of the other. Less work for the plumbers as their PVC doesn't necessarily bend so easy and I don't believe code allows for any 90's in the vent stack.
Having said that apparently the builder of this home didn't pay much attention to code nor could the plumber spell or read.
Thanks again.
Re "Stacked": gotcha! Anyway, I'd just replace the CGFI. And consider placing a CGFI in each bathroom - the way its wired would allow it...
>Appliances that generate a lot of electrical "noise", such as motors,tend to pop GFI's, especially those that are nearing the end of their service life. I'd replace the master CGFI, and would not, in the future, plug a vacuum into a CGFI.
So what about all the garages/workshops out there with required GFCI's on all the outlets? Is it a constant battle to keep things running? So far I haven't had any problems running saws, shop-vac, etc. on the 1 outlet I've got hooked up in the garage I'm building.
Don
More details: I was thinking of CGFIs that were nearing the end of their service life. As they age they seem (in my humble experience) to trip more easily.When I mentioned motors I was thinking of motors with brushes. I had an
electric razor that started knocking out my CGFI about once a week. I replaced the CGFI and the problem went away. The RF from the brushes
seems to be the problem - I've never had this type of problem with a brush-less synchronous motor such as those in a saw, etc.And, of course, its possible that his vacuum actually has a ground fault...-- Brooks
"I've never had this type of problem with a brush-less synchronous motor such as those in a saw, etc."For the record that is an induction motor. Not a synchronous motor.The only sunchronous motors that I know of in a house are in line operated clocks. And possibly record players.
I didn't know there was a difference until today! I looked athttp://www.tpub.com/content/neets/14177/css/14177_93.htmand - you're right!
Brooks