I’m hoping to get some opinions on framing nailors(full round head 22deg).. Everyone i work with swears by Senco but my complaint with them is when using 2″ 8d nails the guns jam, double-fire, misfire.. you name it. has anyone used the dewalt guns? the paslode?, Duo-Fast(or is that the same as paslode?), MAX?, hitachi?, how ’bout bostich? Im looking at the Bostich heavily because of the low price.. opinions?
Any of you who take the time to chime in i certinly do appriciate your time
Replies
paslode powermaster plus ...
Jeff
Buck Construction, llc Pittsburgh,PA
Artistry in Carpentry
I use clipped-head framers; I have both Senco and Paslode, and both work well, but the Senco definitely has more punch--which is not to say the Paslode doesn't have enough, it does--just that it's not in the same class with the Senco. Not much is, actually. Just the price diff between the two brands can tell you that.
Guns that have trouble when feeding shorter nails are usually getting cranky because of feed problems in the magazine. Make sure the springs are not kinked and that all the moving parts in the mag are well lubricated.
My old Senco (a model III) has a magazine track that allows an 8d clip to sheer sideways and jam or stick in the magazine. Thus, not enough pressure on the clip and a nail half-in/half-out of the firing chamber, which causes misfires, bent nails, bad jams, etc. The solution to this particular problem was to keep a short clip of four 3½" nails in my pouch, and slide them into the magazine behind the clips of two inchers. The long nails caught the clip follower perfectly, and transferred its push to the clips of short nails, so feed was straight and the short nails didn't veer out of the track. Still, the easiest solution was to run 2-3/8" nails instead of 2". (The newer Sencos don't have this problem.)
AFIK, Senco makes the only framing gun with enough power to drive hardened nails into concrete. Somebody else might know of another brand, though. ??
Dinosaur
'Y-a-tu de la justice dans ce maudit monde?
As far as I'm concerned, there is only one name in all of pnumatic guns....Hitachi. I've used about every framing gun you can think of, and my Hitachi guns are the ones I always go back to.
Along those lines, I did pick up a used DeWalt nailer from my tool rep as a back-up/ "i helped my dad frame his basement" labor guy to use. It is light, but i found that i had problems shooting 8d nails....and nothing...NOTHING is as frustrating as nailing down floor sheething in the following pattern... pop, pop, pop, schlunk..(remove jammed nail)...pop, pop, schlunk...(cuss, remove nail again)....REPEAT!
MAX or Hitachi, you pick you win.
I can't speak for Hitachi but I have used most other guns and they are all just nail starters except for the Max gun. Don't think twice and if they are hard to come by, make the extra effort to go find one. It is a heavier gun then others but that helps on the double fire issue.
I use Paslode nails. They are simply better than the others and don't come out even when you are trying to take them out. My gun shoots clipped and round head nails (the round head nail is a Paslode nail that has the round head offset from the center of the nail shaft.... great nail).
In my opinion, the gun is unbeatable at $279. And I have never had a jam. In fact, I don't even think I can tell you what the mechanism is for clearing a jam from that gun (but I know it has that facility). Forget the Dewalt gun. I have a couple of their guns (not framers) and they are just crap.
Good luck
Rob Kress
If you are just looking for basic function at a good price the big boxes are clearing out the old Bostich framing model.
Saw one in HD for $190 and in Lowes for $140 still in the box.
be dead on or that quarter inch is going to haunt you
So far, I'm loving my Bostich N88RH. Take two seconds to switch the tip, and it's a positive placement nailer for joist hangers. I got mine on Amazon for a little over two bills, with a palm nailer thrown in the bargain.
Andy
Arguing with a Breaktimer is like mud-wrestling a pig -- Sooner or later you find out the pig loves it.
I'll second the vote for the bostich rh 88. Handles teco's& lvls without a hitch.
And it's incredibly light, with a magnesium body.Arguing with a Breaktimer is like mud-wrestling a pig -- Sooner or later you find out the pig loves it.
I just got the Hitachi and like it very much. Got it based on a review out of Journal of Light Construction. They rated it the highest.
Hitachi nr83 ( i think ) is all the help you will need, things just will not die and almost never jamb ( cant rember the last time a nail hung on me).
james
there!
it's settled.
glad we could all agree ...
JeffBuck Construction, llc Pittsburgh,PA
Artistry in Carpentry
Wow! lots of opinions thanks to everyone who joined the conversation. I just found a slightly used Bostich n88rh for 100bucks and I cant argue with that although i must admit Im nervouse about going bostich, at work we have a backup finish nailor made by bostich and although it works I dont like using it half as much as the senco's we use. hopefully the framing gun will be a bit nicer
I tested about 10 or 11 20-22° stick nailers for JLC last winter and spring. The 2 guns that the 6 of us who used them picked were the Max SN890RH and the Hitachi NR83A2. You will be happy with either gun. They rarely jammed and both are extremely well bell balanced. We have 2 NR83As and they are old and have worked flawlessly for about 10 years. After the test, I bought a Max and love it. It's our 2nd Max, the other is a framing coil nailer.
I bought the Max because it will shoot a .148" diameter nail and the Hitachi only shoots up to a .131" nail. We need the bigger nail for some applications. The Max also has a great feature. You can open up the nosepiece without taking anything apart and clear a jam if it does happen.
I own 2 Bostich guns and both crapped out on us in less than 6 months. The first gun was a first generation and the second we bought after they had been on the market for about 2 years. They are nice guns, but don't seem to last very long. I talked to our repair guy and he said the same thing. Both of ours are in the shop right now.
I also have a DeWalt gun. It's the second one we've owned. We traded in the first one. The second one is just as crappy. Now I did test the updated version and it seems ok, but I wouldn't buy it.
I'm testing a Fasco right now and it's a nice gun, but that is about all I can say. I hate Sencos with a passion, in fact everyone did.
I hope this helps. The Max is expensive, but I feel it's worth it. The Hitachi is a reliable gun that has been around forever. Make sure you buy the NR83A2 if you get one. It has been updated to include a dial type flush nailer.
Let me know what you get.
You may have a point on the Bostitch, Tim. I've only had it for a few months, and this is the first full house I'm framing with it. We'll see how it lasts.
AndyArguing with a Breaktimer is like mud-wrestling a pig -- Sooner or later you find out the pig loves it.
keep me posted on how yours does too andy
My guys have been using the Bostitch more than I have. Both of them are complaining about blisters from it on their thumbs and forefingers. They'll be callouses soon, but there's definitely some odd ergonomics going on. Other than the that, it's the first gun they reach for.
AndyArguing with a Breaktimer is like mud-wrestling a pig -- Sooner or later you find out the pig loves it.
Andy,
Tell them real men don't use hand lotion when they get home from work :-)
Reminds me of an episode of TOH. Steve Thomas asked the mason to show him some tricks. The mason took Steve's hands in his, and went on to say something like, "These aren't mason's hands. They're soft. What are you, an artist?" Had me chuckling.
AndyArguing with a Breaktimer is like mud-wrestling a pig -- Sooner or later you find out the pig loves it.
we bought our N88RH when they first came out.. then we bought the Positive placement nose at a Bostich Day at our lumber yard..
next Bostich Day i bought our 2d N88 and this one came with both noses..
paid $197..with a trade in of some old iron we had laying around...
no problems so far..... really like it in both modes... lots of power.. esy depth adjustment.. and the positive placement nose is really slickMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
The only caution I have probably applies to all PP nailers. Be sure to have the tip in the hole and the gun square to the hanger before pulling the trigger. A slight misalignment had me bleeding the other week from a nail that travelled a foot through the air.
Also, only use any PP nailer in the sequential trip mode, that is, non-bounce fire. In fact, that's how I keep both of my guns all the time. The slight amount of time saved by bounce nailing seems inconsequential to me in light of the huge time savings offered by nail guns anyway. And the risk of injury is much lower.
AndyArguing with a Breaktimer is like mud-wrestling a pig -- Sooner or later you find out the pig loves it.
i agree with you about sequential fire, do you know if any gun manufacturers make a gun that can switch fire modes (bounce to sequential and back) on the fly, without swiching out the trigger which takes so long? At work I admit i do use bounce fire but I would love to be able to hit a button or pull a lever to easily swich back and forth
Haubolt.......shoots round heads, big, red and kinda heavy...........been using the same one for over fifteen years, dropped, kicked, buried alive, comes up shooting every time................can't remember ever fixing it.......even tells me when it wants an oil drink..........made in Germany.
The newer Hitachi NR 83A2's have a little slide switch near the trigger to go from sequential to bump-fire. Nice feature. I believe that the Max guns have a similar set up.
I've got a Cambell/Hausfeld that is switched between modes by flicking a wire bale above the trigger up or down. It's actually not a bad gun for the money, but lacks pp potential.
AndyArguing with a Breaktimer is like mud-wrestling a pig -- Sooner or later you find out the pig loves it.
That reminds me of about a year and a half ago. I was shooting on a beam hanger that supported a glulam into a glulam. It was a heavier duty metal hanger and the tip of the gun wasn't quite in the hole. The gun recoiled into my forehead and left a nice phillips head mark. It didn't hurt much, but I had to wear my hat lower so the guys wouldn't see it. At first I was mad and then I just couldn't help but laugh. Now I make sure my body is out of the way when I'm shooting with that thing :-)
Much better to laugh than to be bitter.
AndyArguing with a Breaktimer is like mud-wrestling a pig -- Sooner or later you find out the pig loves it.
wow tim that was a helpful post. I ended up buying the Bostich off e-bay because i couldnt turn down the low price. I'll keep you guys posted on how it does. The project it's for is pretty small, just a two car garage (actually art studio for pops who is about to retire) and after that Im sure I'll give it some heavy abuse at work. But Im really cureus why you dont like the Senco guns, like I said earlier I've used only Sencos but i really have no major complaints they feel solid, predictable and powerfull to me, we abuse the $%i& out of them at work and they never need service.
Skyecore,
The Sencos were nice guns, but compared to the Max and Hitachi they weren't as refined. I did love the nosepiece on them. They were great for toenailing. I didn't like the rear load(or as one framer said "butt load") magazine. The gun is a good gun, but the Hitachi and Max were just really good.
You know how you read in Road & Track where they test a bunch of really high end cars next to each other? And they just nit pick? Between a BMW, Audi, Mercedes, Infiniti, Lexus, there are differences, but they are great cars. Same thing with the guns.
I like the Bostich, my only complaint is that ours haven't lasted long. What I do love about it, is you can shoot a real 16d nail. We ordered a box just for that gun and used the postive placement with the 16d to shoot on our holddown straps. It worked ok and was better than hand nailing, but you aren't supposed to do it. :-) That didn't break the guns though :-)
The Senco, Bostich and DeWalt guns are selling about $100 cheaper than the Hitachi right now at the local lumberyard. I know a lot of guys are buying them because of that. Your's will probably last. We abuse our guns pretty bad.
"I'm testing a Fasco right now " --quoted from timuhler
pardon my ignorance but what is a Fasco? I googled it but diddnt get anything.
I've owned a Senco 752, Max 890RH, and a Max 890CH in that order all in the last 4 months, because I had jamming issues.
I decided after the second full-round head nailer that the jamming issue was related to the plastic collation material, especially bitchy if the sticks are laying in the sun for awhile and if you're trying to shoot 8's. The second gun, Max FRH was fine for framing, but when I started doing a siding job it would place a lovely halo of plastic around each nail- just what you're looking for on your cypress siding - hell might as well hand nail if I have to go back and yank plastic off every nail.
Took back the Max and got 100% credit after 3 months to get the 890 in clipped head with paper tape.
LIFE IS GRAND AGAIN!
Max is a great gun, but the aimable exhaust port always seems to be aimed right under the brim of my hat - I think it's gnomes.
Paslode Powermaster Plus! Hoorah
Meangene