A kitchen is one of those big ticket item parts of a house. I some times wonder how long is a kitchen good before before it is replace, either due to wear out or being dated.
perhaps it should be broken down, say floor, appliances, cabinets, counter top.
it seems that appliance sizes change over time so even if your cabinets are good, changes have to be made when say the refrigerator has to be replace, because it is built-in.
while I know that the quality of the product effects things, but being dated can cause the thing being replaced.
for some reason 15-20 years seems to be the life of a kitchen.
bobl Volo, non valeo
“But when you’re a kibbutzer and have no responsibility to decide the facts and apply the law, you can reach any conclusion you want because it doesn’t matter.” SHG
Replies
Just my opinion, but the "decorative" parts will date a kitchen faster than the appliances. For example, a white fridge is a white fridge but make it avocado green or stainless & you KNOW when it was installed.
I tend to like the more "timeless" look, probably 'cause I've got an old house already. When I purchase my house, the kitchen was split pea soup green. After a bit of time, I looked at it and thought, "Cobalt blue & white. This kitchen wants to be colbalt blue & white". Looks a bijillion times better now.
I've walked in a couple of open houses where the kitchen was screaming to be red w/white checks or a nice sunny yellow. Dunno why, it's just my impression.
"The red-cherryish impression of Cantine Argiolas's Costera (2004-15USD) is spiced with notes of black pepper and terra-cotta." How the hell does someone know what terra-cotta tastes like?!?!
100 years is not unknown.
My Grandfather built the house my Dad, uncles, and aunts were born in. Built it in 1907, exactly 100 years ago. Grandma died in '74, was still using the same kitchen, sink, counters, cabinets, floor, etc. When she died.
Pop lived on the same block so used the house for storage for 30 years.
After Pop died, Brother started re-doing the house last year. (JohnT8 and Boss Hog got a tour last year)
Brother is keeping the cabinets, sink, counters - he did replace the pipes exposed under sink which go direct into basement) . He did tear off the plaster to add insulation to the outside walls. Resanded and refinished the vert grain fir floor. Brother even had the city Mayor over, as the mayor was excited about somebody fixing a house up in the 'gone downhill' but now recovering neighborhood.
Did add a new light fixture and re-wired. Only had one outlet and that was on the stove. He did replace the stove.
Otherwise, if G&G came back, they would recognize the kitchen..
So, 100 years is not unknown.
The sink and drain board are one piece cast iron, zero chips after 100 years - even the faucets are still good. Think brother also replaced the linoleum on the counter top.
What goes around, comes around, retro kitchen now a big deal<G>
it depend on the wife wine list. "you dont love me no more"
"you dont spend no money"
"this paint is dirty"
"the dishwasher makes noise"and the ol mighty"But Jill husband bought her a new refrigerator with ice cubes in the door".Know BOB, Know Peace
Every time ya change wives.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"If you want something you've never had, do something you've never done"
LOL, I redid a kitchen for a guy about three times in five years - once for each new woman
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Nah,
Buy once, rent after that.
wives that is, not kitchens
I've had girl friends throw out gifts left behind from the previous girl friend, table cloths, a wok, things of that nature. I was like WTF? is something wrong with keeping that ?Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"If you want something you've never had, do something you've never done"
>>>I've had girl friends throw out gifts left behind from the previous girl friend, table cloths, a wok, things of that nature. I was like WTF? is something wrong with keeping that ?Baggage man, baggage. There are sentiments, hormones and memories attached to all that.....must be disposed of, or mitigated somehow. No male equivalent, does not compute.Scott.Always remember those first immortal words that Adam said to Eve, “You’d better stand back, I don’t know how big this thing’s going to get.”
I can understand her not wanting to sleep in the same bed, but to not want to cook and eat in the same kitchen is insane for my opinion. And knick-knacks? how threatening can they be anyways? These are deeply insecure women
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"I can understand her not wanting to sleep in the same bed as Sphere..."Yeah, I know... He drags wood chips and roofing nails into bed, and has far too much 'essence du Sphere'.... some girls like it, some don't....Hahahahaha ;)Scott.Always remember those first immortal words that Adam said to Eve, “You’d better stand back, I don’t know how big this thing’s going to get.”
ok, you be the one to tell them that.
YOU USE SPECIAL WORDSdarn caps key is stuck and working in opposite
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What is wrong with me? I must be stupid or these women yall are talking about are seriously in need of a LIFE!
When Mike and I moved in together, I slept in the same bed that had belonged to him and his ex up until 2 years ago when the mattress wore out and had to be replaced! He still has pictures stored away of his 1st wife. I have never asked him to get rid of them and never will. To do so would be taking away a part of who is is today.
Am I crazy? Or just a rare breed? I don't understand why women act that way.My DH wears the pants in the family. But I control the zipper!
I don't understand why women act that way.
Because they're insecure and frankly, dumb.
Obviously, if they act the way most have described.
Life is way too short for BS like that. My DH wears the pants in the family. But I control the zipper!
NEVER admit that something came from a former wife/girlfriend/etc."She took EVERYTHING we ever bought together. I had to go out to garage sales and scrounge just to get a workable kitchen."That way they can't want to just throw it out.
Rent!????Why not just borrow?
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touche.
perhaps it should be broken down, say floor, appliances, cabinets, counter top.
Own house example - built it in '74.
Same kitchen sink (stainless double bowl) as original, but one faucet change.
Redid the floor in 2000 as DW wanted a lighter color (had been sheet vinyl red, as I got that flooring for under $1/yard, but it was still in good shape)
Did the floor again in 2005 - see old thread "shrinking vinyl tile" as the $2.30 sq ft vinyl tile actually shrank after 4 years, leaving cracks. Used heavy off white sheet vinyl this time.
Still have same cabinets (Teak and oak I made, no way I was going to replace those) but did add full side extension slides.
Ceiling (bottom of car decking) is still the same.
Walls are still the same - not even re-painted as are stone patterned 3/8" hardboard - that stuff has really held up well.
Same wall oven (black whirlpool)
Replaced dishwasher in 2005 (with exactly the same low end GE model, it was still being made)
Since I was going to do the floor, and had come across a free maple bowling alley not yet assembled, redid the counters with 1-1/2 thick edge grain maple with marble accents.
Replaced the cooktop with an induction cooktop.
Same lighting fixtures. 2nd fridge (just 'cause DW wanted a bottom vs. top freezer). Same kitchen wiring as original (6 separate 20 A circuits, 40 A for cooktop, 50 A for oven)
Did add 2 microwave oven over the years.
My house example - built in or around 1991.Same kitchen sink (stainless double bowl) as original, but one faucet change
(low Ph well water corroded the valves and seals)Sheet vinyl flooring replaced about 10 years ago (damaged when new stove was delivered -- see below); now needs replacing again.Still have same cabinets (with repairs to one broken drawer); would like to build my own when the time is right, or upgrade to semi-custom with plywood cases and a different look.Ceiling is still the same.Walls are still the same Range replaced about 10 years ago (wife wanted gas/propane, not electric)Replaced dishwasher in 2001 (low-end GE -- or was it Whirlpool? -- replaced with Bosch, much better)Same Formica counters (need repair to damage from hot pan), would like to replace with something that is durable and has a different look (engineered stone?)Same lighting fixtures. Same fridge.Same kitchen wiring .Microwave oven has been replaced once.Summary: This kitchen was built about 16 years ago with "builder's grade" parts that have held up, I suppose, about as well as to be expected.
I think most kitchens are "dated" long before they physically wear out.
I would encourage anyone who plans to keep their home for many years to try to avoid anything that is "trendy." Trendy is dated in short order.
Looking through magazines that date back a few decades can be eye-opening. Many kitchens from 20 or 30 or 40 years ago still look good. They are timeless usually because they are based on classic or antique designs, or mesh with the construction era of the home.
The ones that don't hold up were the ones that adopted some new style or material, like white laminate cabinet doors. Or light-colored oak.
Chrome fixtures, for example, are classic and will always be in style. Remember how great those brass faucets looked back in the '80s! They usually appear horribly dated today. I expect the same for the "rubbed bronze" and similar finishes of today.
Sometimes I'll watch those home-decorating shows on HGTV, and note how often the "expert" will whine, "Oh, that kitchen is SOOOO 1990s! It's gotta go." 1990s? Geez, I've been planning my next kitchen since then!
Well, just some random thoughts.
Allen
Very good point, ESPECIALLY about the shiny brass finish (and the oil rubbed bronze). Sometimes tho, certain populations LIKE the shiny brass finish, so that's what sells...even now!Where are my Chocolate Cupcakes?!? HMPF Talk-Like-A-Pirate day gets more respect than National Chocolate Cupcake Day.
I have saw in Europe the kitchern are furniture so when they move, they take the cabinets with them..Know BOB, Know Peace
"kitchern are furniture so when they move, they take the cabinets with them"
Now, there's a trend that's worth jumping onto! It actually harkens back to early kitchens. And is the next logical step to today's trend of making built-in cabinetry and islands appear to be individual pieces of furniture.
Allen
Here you'd have to put it in the contract, until & unless kitchens are all standard size & look. Generally in Europe, people move from apartment to apartment. My sister tried to sell her "kitchen" to the landlord and they turned it down flat. Definitely a short sighted landlord. They could have rented to foreign students who don't HAVE a kitchen to move into an apartment. Call it a "fully furnished kitchen".Where are my Chocolate Cupcakes?!? HMPF Talk-Like-A-Pirate day gets more respect than National Chocolate Cupcake Day.
like the hoosier cabinets
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"Sometimes tho, certain populations LIKE the shiny brass finish, so that's what sells...even now!"
There's a market for everything. Black-chrome-and-gold accessories are still popular amongst some folk.
Style is a funny thing. Powdered wigs were popular for quite a while. In the late 1700s when they fell into disfavor, some men were disappointed. John Adams wrote that he rather liked the way they had covered his baldness.
Hey, and I still wear my shirts tucked in!
Allen
"I would encourage anyone who plans to keep their home for many years to try to avoid anything that is "trendy." Trendy is dated in short order."
I figure in five or ten years, everyone will be tearing out those dated granite countertops and replacing them with whatever is in style by then.
You are so so right.Been planning my kitchen for 11 yearssince I've been in house. Will be planningfor a few more 'til I can afford to do it.New floor, paint, hardware and lighting tho...<g>
Mclaren
I built my house five years ago, I still have no kitchen, my sink is on a sheet of plywood. I have no idea which way to go. I want simple but the resale value killing me..Know BOB, Know Peace
brownbagg,
You aren't alone there.. I tore my house down in stages, the kitchen went about 5 years ago.. Since then the counter top has been sheetrock with some shelf paper on it.. Set on top the old cabinets.. It will be at least another year before she gets her real kitchen. I have to make the cabinets before they can be installed..
re:
I have to make the cabinets before they can be installed..
Consider building in place?. I did oak and teak on fir frames (frames literally part of house framing) , less time I think than building and installing stand alone cabinets.
I'd say that nationally the styles change every 8 to fifteen years.
used to bne that good appliances would last 30-40 years no troubles, but I'm not sure I expect to see anything I install now lasting that long.
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Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
just redid our kitchen from 1977, My wife started getting mad around 1985, real mad around 1990, Superduper mad around 1995, Tortured her till last year then built her a brand new one, I dunno she never cooked anything in there anyway and still does not, But if the Queen comes over for tea dagumit we are READY
Taking into account everything you cited in you first post, i'd say a kitchen lasts as long as the wife says it does.:>)
I see style and durability as very seperate issues.
The kitchen in my in-laws house is the original from 1964. It isn't pretty but it's well built and has lasted this whole time.
The kitchen in the house I just moved from was from 1988, and besides being dated it was worn to the point of no longer being functional. It just wasn't built to the same quality level as the one in my In-law's place.
The kitchen I put in is a pretty classic look and should go a while before being dated. About 15 or so years which is right around how long I think the materials involved will last.
The house I'm in now was built in 1997. My kitchen here is worn pretty badly. Not from abuse. It's just not as well put together.
I often wonder what the realistic life span of the homes built in the last ten years will be.
bobl,
The James J Hill house in St Paul still has the same kitchen from the 1880's you could add modern appliances in it today and it would remain a well functioning kicthen.
Think timeless style not trends and things function for more thana century.
IMHO, grease build up kills a kitchen quicker than anything. Don't use frame and panel doors, as they are grease catchers and are nothing more than a sop for by-gone materials. Make the cab carcases painted and easy to clean. Use easy-cleaning slab doors. Get a good vent and use it. Forget tile on countertops as the grout gets dirty and/or chipped. Tile on the floor sucks too. Gets dirty too easy.
Use a lot of stainless steel. Hell, make everything out of SS and you won't have a problem...
Use a lot of stainless steel. Hell, make everything out of SS and you won't have a problem...
Got one of those right here!
Hey, you got the right idea. Nice.
Until I saw the stove, I thought it was a morgue...
all tha ss and cheapy white plug in covers,whats with that?larryif a man speaks in the forest,and there's not a woman to hear him,is he still wrong?
cheapy white plug in covers
You better take a look again, there isnt anything cheap about the electrical in this house.
Doug
Larry
I don't think you can see the plug from that pic so I have one for you from a different room, just different color. These things are a pain in the azz, they have a ring underneath the cover that the plug/receptacle mounts to and then the cover plate mounts to that.
I don't know where you get them but I'm pretty sure not at HD or Lowes!
Doug
C'mon Doug, don't be a tease. Post a pic with the drawers open so we can see the stainless dovetail joinery holding it all together!Bill
Bill, now that would be showing off!
Doug
what is venting over that grill?
I'm hoping that is in a showroom displaying an outdoor kitchen, somehow I doubt it.
Looks like a horrible idea to me.
my luck they turn the gas on without lifting the hood and boom, there goes the house.Know BOB, Know Peace
what is venting over that grill?
I'm not sure I know what you mean, the grill is an outdoor grill and the hood that is currently shown flips back, there is a big vent up in that tiled back. I don't know if that grill has a cover to do rotisserie stuff, not sure, I don't have anything like it in my house!
And yes, its an outdoor kitchen. It's completely enclosed (as in a porch) but I guess the're calling it an outdoor kitchen. I think these people just wanted one of everything.
Doug
Edited 10/20/2007 7:46 pm ET by DougU
wish I had more money then intelligence.
that grill in an enclosed area has to be one of the dumbest things I've seen.
To tell you the truth I'd guess it will never get used, or rarely!
These people had an interior decorator in and all she saw was dollar signs, she would see a blank wall and add shid, probably just to run her bill up higher. No taste what-so-ever in this place.
I went back to do some touch up and down in the basement was a cool pool table, one I'd love to have. On the rack of cues was 5 or 6 CD's on how to play pool! For Christs sake man, if you dont know how to play pool by the time your 35 then dont even bother, or go down to the local bar and learn the way the rest of us did.
Doug
Back in the 80's I visited a mansion in Atlantic City that still had an enamel metal kitchen from the (?) 30's. In good shape, functioning well, in fact it even looked sort of modern.Enamel has the advantage of extremely good cleanability and will also hold magnets (which the wife loves).
My kitchen is being updated as we speak. It wasn't by my choice though. When we moved into the house, none of the appliances worked. The cabinets, I thought, just needed a good cleaning and a fresh coat of paint. Bambam wanted new ones. One wall is finished, well almost. Still needs counter tops and doors on the cabinets.
We have all new stainless appliances. The same sink, which I argued to keep. The linoleum has been pulled up. No choice on that either. Previous renter had 4 big dogs, 2 cats, 20 birds, 3 hellion kids. The smell was ungodly!
I am simple and would like the cabinets finished, since most of the old ones were torn out and I now have no storage. The rest, who cares is my attitude.
Well, a dish washer would be nice.
My DH wears the pants in the family. But I control the zipper!
In my opinion, the only cabinets that never seem to look dated are made from cherry. They always seem to have a classy look no matter how old they are.
Rich