I have two small homes built in the ’20s. Last week my sons and I gutted out most of the lath and plaster. Now I have questions.
First off, these houses are located in a small town with low real estate prices so it’s not financially feasable to just do everything as I’d want normally want to if the market value was there. If I’d sold them “as is” they may have brought $40k. If I fix them up to new code (as interpreted by our local not-quite-an-expert building inspector) they’ll maybe be worth $80k tops. Makes it tough, doesn’t it?
Our climate is very dry. Most of our moisture comes fast and goes fast. For old house preservation, this is a very good thing.
We found that the outside walls are ship-lap fir (I think) siding nailed directly to the studs. No sheathing of any sort. There is a mostly disintegrated piece of builder’s paper (not asphalt) under the studs at the low end of the walls and nothing above. The siding is in pretty good shape considering and fortunately the main wall faces north and is protected by a 24″ overhang and the neighbors carport which is only about five feet from the roof edge. Any suggestions as to a cost effective means to seal up and protect the house as well as possible without turning an investment into a philanthopic venture?
One room was obviously a patio – then covered patio – then minimally closed in with same cracked and shifting slab as both floor and foundation. I plan to build a wood floor over it (not sitting on it). Problem is that one side of the room has a crumbly sandstone foundation as the wall I’d have to fasten the floor to. It sits in place by habit and gravity, but I don’t think it would be good to drill, bolt, and hang a new floor from it. I have the idea that I could glue and screw 3/4″ ply to the wall above and then hang the floor from the bottom edge of the ply without anything sitting on the old floor. Whaddya think, BTer’s?
I know this is completely out of the ordinary, but so is the little town I live in.
Forget about asking the inspector for what he’d accept. He already told me on a previous project that I “was going about this all wrong”. “Don’t ask for permission, just tell me what you’re going to do and I’ll come by and inspect it.” I’ve never failed one of his inspections. He checks with me occasionally to ask my opinion of something he’s being asked to inspect. He’s a good guy, but he’s more worried about junk cars and barking dogs than he is about someone who’s fixing an old house and he’s both building and zoning dept. in one man who works 20 hours a week now that they found some extra money to pay him to increase his schedule. ; )
Yes, city boys. Lots of the country is still like this.
I’m thankful for the loyal opposition! It’s hard to learn much from those who simply agree with you.
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Has, tell me if I have this right. The wall you want to miraculously hang the floor system from is sitting on that crumbling foundation?
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
It's already sitting on it. You got it right.
Like I said, that laid sandstone isn't going anywhere as long as it's untouched. Take a roto hammer to it with a 5/8" bit and I think I might shake the thing apart.
I'm thankful for the loyal opposition! It's hard to learn much from those who simply agree with you.
Not sure what to tell you, other than Sphere mentioned something about biting off more than you want to chew. I guess I'd be exploring a way to pour new concrete to support your new framing. Use the old sandstone to be a form on the outside and pour something you can use. Or use blocks if you're more comfortable with that. I'm assuming it is not very cold where you're building but the way I'd seal that up without removing the siding would be to get all my wiring and heating/cooling done and get those wall stud cavities sprayed with insulation (foam). That would provide an air/moisture barrier and superinsulate it all in one shot. Yes it is expensive compared to fiberglass but still a bargain considering what you get from it.Hate to say it, but if you're all worried about resale value in a depressed area, gutting a house is not usually a good investment; but maybe there's more to it than that. Maybe some good experience in store for you on this one?Good luck,Dog
Thanks for the input.
I've owned the place for ten years and I bought it when I couldn't afford anything else. We lived there for nine years, but moved into our new place last September, which sons and I built. I could have dumped it without doing anything, but I hope to take advantage of the tax free income of redoing the place before sale. I could also just keep it and rent both houses. BTW, DW and I are in the real estate business.
I've gutted and redone quite a few houses over the past 25 years or so, so it's not an exciting new learning experience. I've haven't run into one before that had nothing but studs under the siding, have you? Your suggestion of foam is probably the best solution with dense pack cellulose somewhat of a second best.I'm thankful for the loyal opposition! It's hard to learn much from those who simply agree with you.
Yes, some old farmhouses here are like that. And many more were made that way but have since been converted due to heating bills. Many garages made like that here as well.In one sense it is a testament to the breathability of this system to help it last this long and be in as good of shape as you say. Wonder how long it would have lasted with Tyvek under it?Another thing is that it could have been good quality wood from old growth trees.Well, I didn't tell you anything you didn't already know about the money. Maybe you can treat the big issues as economically as possible, get the house back together with plenty of hard work and still stay in that $40k window. I don't know where you are located, but my area is expensive. Most contractors are billing in the $50-$60/hr range for carpenters. Electricians are in the $50 range and plumbers about $85. But I could make about a four hour drive and those numbers would be maybe half of this. And houses in Wisconsin tend to be more expensive because of insulation/heating and other environmental concerns.
It's an iffy deal, but I'm stuck with it and will do the best I can... plus, I just feel like doing it... it was my place and I always wanted to redo it, but couldn't because of finances and then timing.I'm thankful for the loyal opposition! It's hard to learn much from those who simply agree with you.
I think ya bit off more than I am chewin...LOL
No help from me, I just talked with county today, I need 2 permits. And 1 ele. insp.
Sounds daunting from here, can ya form and pour next to the old foundation?
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"Sell your cleverness, Purchase Bewilderment"...Rumi
We hang joists and trusses by metal hangers, right? And those hangers are nailed on, right? And they are nailed to wood, right?
I realize my idea of hanging a floor from plywood is a new one. I've never seen it done, but why not do it? I'm looking for an engineering type reason, not a "It just isn't done sort of reason." If there is a reason not to do it, I could approach it in a more conventional way. But is there a reason?
BTW, the floor in question would have a span of only just over 8', so 2x8 joists 16" oc will be fine for the span and the 8' span means less load than usual for the hanging mechanism.
I'm thankful for the loyal opposition! It's hard to learn much from those who simply agree with you.