This is a 4 year old house I have been doing some REPAIRS on. Yes, that’s right, repairs. It has pine fingerjointed trim (UGH), and the siding is hardiplank.
I have seen this detail a couple of times. The garage jogs back from the main house, but not enough for the eve overhang to avoid breaking into the cornerboards. There is no kickout, and I plan on adding one. But to make things a lil bit complicated, there is a 1×3 that is nailed onto the 1×8 corner that serves as another diverter, kicking more water behind the cornerboard and siding.
So the question of the hour is, what sort of detail can I apply in order to put a kickout in? I may try to form a piece of lead that tucks under the siding and roofing, but laps over the corner. Thoughts?
Thanks,
Dustin
Replies
What a nightmare! Use a siding that won't rot and then detail it to suck all the run-off into the wall behind it!
Either a lead wrap to divert the water out or slice right through the corner to let the water continue with flashing out.
Did that last make sense?
Me neither
Whjat I mean is - if doing it new, the corner bd would have a ut at that eacve the same pitch as the roof hitting it, then the lead would run over it all the way out to outside of corner bd. Then the upper piece of CB added on up to soffit.
That looks ugly tho sometimes, but is the best I know for keeping water out.
Welcome to the
Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
Makes sense to me, but I'm not sure that's and especailly good thing. =)~ Ted W ~
Cheap Tools! - MyToolbox.netSee my work at TedsCarpentry.com
I catch your drift perfectly Piff. I think I will study the pics some more and see what I can conjure up, think I am on the right track. If anyone else has any input or has dealt with similar, please comment!
Thanks,
Dustin
I think I'd cut the trim off flush with the roof and then up 3 inches to make room for the water. The kickout would go to the outside edge of the trim before turning. It sure is a lousy detail.
Florida said "It sure is a lousy detail."
Clearly not professionally done.
I don't like the way that siding sits so close to the comp roof, either. What's gonna keep water from wicking up those cut (and unpainted) edges of siding?
Freakin' hacks. I bet the GC (or "owner/builder") didn't even notice.
Jim, that is the biggest worry for me with the fc end cuts being unsealed. I have taken a drywall trowel, shoved it between siding and roof, and tryed to "squeegee" as much solid body stain as I could onto the end cuts. I let the HO know I didn't like the detail and would try to rectify as best as I could. After only 4 years, there is already delamination and erosion occurring.
I know the guy who built the place. I have done finish work for him a bunch of times. I mentioned that the hardi was supposed to have an inch clearance off rooflines to him once, at another home, and he said "Oh yeah, well I don't like the look of seeing the flashing."
As much as I hate doing stuff like this, I am glad to be working.
Dustin
Did they use step flashing at least?
Yeah there is step, thank goodness.
Dustin
4x4x12? Is that what you guys use thereabouts?
That is common practice, yes.
If you get lucky, maybe whoever flashed that wall knew enough to only fasten the flashing to the roof, not the wall. If that's the case you could pretty easilly strip off the shingles against the wall, slide all the flashing up or down the slope (whichever is easier) and run a skillsaw with a fiber cement blade up that rake to give that siding enough clearance, then reposition the flashing and shingles.
If it were my house that's what I'd try. A few hours work, but certainly a good investment in the long run.
Of course, you could deal with that disasterous corner board/step flashing detail while you're at it.
As for that knucklehead who's more interested in how something looks than weather it performs - that's a pretty good definition of "gross negligence" in my opinion. I don't hold it against someone who doesn't know any better, but if someone says "yeah, but I don't like the way that would look" and then chooses a detail like that...I guess I'd have a hard time respecting their opinion about anything.
Good luck, man. I really think what's there is correctable, but of course, the homeowner has to believe it, too.
2" gaps might be appropriate in wet climates like Seattle. They are absolutely unnecessary in the more arid regions of the southwest.Have you ever left any hardi siding closer than 2" to the shingles?
hardie has two things they are promoting.... both will never happen on my job... first,....the 2" gap.... we keep our siding 3/4" off the roofing.... all siding... including hardie
the second is hardie eliminating caulking at the butt joints and trim.... makes for a very unfinished look... again... it will never happen on our jobs... i'll switch mfr's if hardie pushes the issueMike Hussein Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Welcome to the world of hacks. Who woulda thought....? Ironically, I worked in a sub that had me leave the proper Hardi spacing for caulk. They did it on one job and when the regional boss saw it he demanded that we eliminate the gap and the caulk on all subsequent jobs. Of course, I had no objection to that. After all, what good would that expensive drainage plane be without a few water entry points?
"Have you ever left any hardi siding closer than 2" to the shingles?"
Yeah, we usually lay a 2x4 flat on the shingles and side to that, so I guess we're a strong 1+1/2". I like to use a 1x or 5/4x trim board at the bottom of that angled siding sometimes, too, with the fiber cement above that. We did that on a very high dormer last year that I doubt will get much maintanance over the years.
It's not just for the sake of the siding. It also leaves enough room for a second layer of shingles without altering the siding 20 years from now.
Welcome to the world of hacks LOL!
Take a jamb saw to that Hardi and get it up off the shingles. Follow the cut right through the 1x on the cornerboard. Turn the lower part of the 1x back into the fascia.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
I mentioned that the hardi was supposed to have an inch clearance off rooflines to him once...Actually, it's worse than you think. Hardie is now calling for 2". That seems excessive to me, but it's better than down on the shingles like that installer did.http://www.jameshardie.com/pdf/install/install_plank_north.pdf
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
Hardi was calling for 2" back about ten years ago. I had to do it once. Of course, no one was happy and we had to go back and add a trim board to cover up the decidedly large "gap". So, the facts are this: anyone NOT LEAVING A 2" GAP IS A HACK! I admit, I am a hack because we only had to leave that 2" gap once...after that the inspector forgot about that detail.
that's quite a hack job....
View Image
One way to make a kicker is shown on p. 88 of FHB #200 (Jan. '09).
It doesn't provide for adequate overlap at the top edge, though -- a couple more folds are needed so that the kicker can slip behind the step flashing, flat to the wall, instead of just being jammed up to the step flashing lap at a 45º angle.
Hard to describe -- a shallow v-shaped fold is needed, what would be called a tuck or a pleat, maybe, in sewing.
AitchKay