LEAD PAINT — Remove and replace doors vs. refinish?
My parents live in a 100 year old house and need to have lead paint removed from the “friction points” of all their doors. The interior doors are solid wood w/ a large stained panel, glass knobs, skeleton keyed, etc. Only the paint on the perimeter (stile?) has lead– the large stained inset area is OK.
The program that they’re enrolled in wants to remove all the doors, stops, and jams. Replace with new solid wood doors, standard locksets, and repaint (3 coats) to match the existing trim and baseboard. Cost is estimated at $350/door + labor.
The doors will be new and have a nice, updated look but my parents like the look of what they have. They feel it goes better with their old house and I tend to agree.
An alternative which the advisior does not suggest is to have the paint planed off and repainted with some gritty abatement paint which won’t look good. That’s just as much or could be more expensive.
What about sending out the doors and having the paint stripped at a lead-safe facility and repainted? I called a place and they charge about $200/door, but it could be less if the stained area can be easily masked. Even if the jam and stop are replaced (or maybe cheaper to have stripped?), it seems that option would be preferable to losing the old doors.
Does anyone have experience in this area? My parents are on the hook for cost and can go any route they choose. The advisor who’s managing the project would like to go down the easiest path which is removal.
Also– unrelated… should a typical handyman be able to hang a slab door in an existing opening? My toddler locked himself in our bedroom and I had to break the door (long story). I have a door slab with no holes, no hinge cutouts, etc. Three handymen on Angie’s List don’t want to get involved with it. One said he needed a special jig which doesn’t pay for one door and the others were non-committal basically finding reasons why it could be difficult. Hollow, cheap door– nothing fancy. ???
Thanks.
Replies
Jim
Cannot advise on which procedure your folks should choose, tho I would agree with keeping the old if at all possible if the conditions warrant it. I would think that the material and joinery in the old doors would be way better than what they offer in the new for 350.00/door.
Also interested in what sort of program they are in, never heard of conditions like you list.
A good carpenter would have no problem hanging the new slab to the old opening. Ask around, find a good one.
same ?? as Cal.
"...need to have lead paint removed from the "friction points" of all their doors."
Why? worried abut the grandkids? What about window sills?
Why just doors, what about trim, etc. -- why not demolish the house and build a new one?
Think of how low the unemployment rate would be for a few years if we tore down a every pre 1978 house and building?
A HUD program of some sort
The township and HUD have a voluntary program for low income seniors where they fix certain hazards in older homes and a portion of the cost is subsidized (sort of ). Some repairs are optional, such as fixing broken sidewalks and adding grab bars to the bathroom. But lead, asbestos, chimney, and electrical issues must be fixed. If they're living there 15 years from now the cost will be forgiven, until then it's a lein on the house. They're 75 years old now.
As you can imagine, it's not hard to spend $60,000 or $80,000 bringing an old home "up to code" and the snowball effect that making one repair can cause. Their house is worth maybe $250k. If they back out of the program now, they're on the hook for the project management / engineering time that already went into the proposal. Not to mention paying out of pocket for the repairs that they do NEED done (fixing crumbling stairs outside, shaky railings, electric panel, grab bars, etc).
Window sills are being addressed somehow. They have newer vinyl windows which eliminated most of the friction points, but I think sills need to be re-painted with special paint at a minimum. Possibly replaced. I don't know all the details on that.
They have a similar lead issue with 4-exterior doors but they have a lot of glass and trim, so they may get replaced plus the storm doors. $$$$
I didn't even get to the plumbing stuff yet... "replace every gate valve with a ball valve. Update hose bibs to anti-freeze faucets". It's about a 5 page proposal and we all know how good seniors are at understanding the nitty gritty on documents.
I'm leaning towards suggesting they take a loan for what they NEED done (maybe 12k) and owe a known amount vs. continue with this program where the sky is the limit.
The doors can be safely stripped to "bare" wood. There would still be some lead left embedded in the wood, but it would not be a hazard. This is something you could have done or do yourself, using chemical strippers (that won't put any lead in the air).
If you replace the jambs with new that will add significantly to the cost. But there's also a question of whether they can be removed and shipped out for stripping (and then reinstalled) without damage and at reasonable cost. Stripping in place is possible but messy.
Hanging a door, when you're not an expert, is tedious (which is why the guys you contacted don't want to do it). But it's not outside the capability of someone with basic wood-working abilities. Mortising for the hinges is tricky without the right tools, but can be done if you take your time and measure VERY carefully.
Check the old door (if you still have pieces of it) to see whether the latch and hinge edges were square or beveled. If square then the new one can be cut/planed square. If beveled then likely the new one will need to be similarly beveled.
You can get a router jig for about $25 that does the hinge mortises.
Now for a trick, and old boy I worked with that owned and managed thirty rental houses: Take the edge off the existing door to the lumber yard or big box and compare it to the spacing on the prehung doors. Most of the factory prehung assemblies since early 70's have the same spacing. I've been succesful three times that way.
Admittedly it's wastefull to throw way the frame, but most of the factory doors of the same size and type have the same layout for the hinges and strike, and just screw in. If you don't own the jig and a router or laminate trimmer, it is less expensive to buy the prehung door and throw out the frame.
Maybe the OP could repupose the slab he bought, and buy a prehung door that would work.
Door hanging
Jim,
Fit the door slab to the opening before you cut the hinges. Manytimes openings are not level or plumb. And often the door has already been putz'd with-cut top, planed edge, etc. Sure, you could use the old door as a template of sorts, but the bevels on the edge make that a tough transfer of the real edge on the same door surface. To cut the hinges b/4 fitting is a mistake waiting to happen.
Gary Katz used to have a primer on hanging to an existing opening on his site- http://www.garymkatz.com
I've seen his presentation on technique a couple times, it's one of the best, simplest and successful ways to go about it.
Lots sounds wrong here
Why are they required to have this lead removed? EPA does not mandate it for older folks.
It would cost me about 350 each just for materials so if tis is proposed to be doemn inc labor, these are cheapazz materials. no where near the quality they now have.
What ahppens to what is removed?
The contractor sells them for more profit to someone else.