OK so this is my first attempt at this in a non passive read only type role. Although I have enjoyed the read only role acquiring knowledge and amusment. . .
Scenerio is a three story situation with a window, slider and window going out onto a deck stacked for the 3 levels. The slider on the 3rd floor is apparently leaking and after a recent wind driven rain the water was leaking at the ceiling of the 2nd floor and staining the drywall along the seams and dripping thru the header of the 2nd floor slider. The plywood at the top level at the stationary jamb leg is starting to go as well. The sliders were made by a company that starts with a “P” who has been no help. The sliders were replaced by “P” about 5 years ago for some reason that we cannot uncover. The sliders are not set in pans. I am the 3rd owner (for about 1 year), The caulking is in good shape with paint that is about 1 1/2 years old and the structure was built in 93.
Any suggestions prior to digging in. . .
Edited 10/18/2005 2:58 pm ET by leakyslider
Replies
In my mind, sliding doors are going to leak sooner or later, and Pella is pretty much a second rate unit regarding quality.
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I try to stay away from sliders altogether however I have been dealt this hand and am having to deal with it. Do you have any preferences or any better luck with any particular type unit and thanks for your tip.
The only sliders I have worked with in the last twenty some years are Marvin and Andersen.
The Andersens are on a house over 30 YO and doing fine. I did minor rot repairs to the Andersen wood casement windows on the same house, but the doors were OKThe Marvins I installed in about '88 or '89. They are still OK too, though they all are under wide awnings or porch roofs, protected from weather. One was a large 42" x 7' unit and the rollers wore out after ten or twelve years of primary use. Marvin replaced them free
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Thanks, I was talking today about how much better the slider would hold up if there was a porch roof built over the deck where the sliding doors are located. I'm not real happy with the Pella folks or the units themselves, so I will check out the Andersen and Marvins that you mentioned. It will be about 3 weeks or so before I get to this tear out so I am trying to get ready to have something to go in the hole after the repairs (if the Pellas are useable I am not sure I want to put them back). Did you make a flashing pan or use any type of pan? I usually flash pretty heavily under doors and run several really heavy beads of caulk under the thresholds when I set them.
Vycor and adhesive caulk under thresholdI seem to remember that Pella's door units frame size is smaller than standard, so check your RO before ordering another brand
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Thanks.
I've no idea if there's a step down from the doorway, of if the deck is at the same level as the floor. One of the remedies you may consider is to place inverted non-return drip ot the bottom of the opening. Depending on the deck level you might place more n-rd over the inner edge of the decking - or custom flashing if there's a step. caulk everything into place.All the best...
To those who know - this may be obvious. To those who don't - I hope I've helped.
There is a 3 1/2 inch step down to the deck which has an azek kick attached below the threshold.
Right, so it's not raining straight across the deck and in. So, I still think that you maybe should flash and counterflash below the slider (using whatever caulks, sill gaskets, backer rod*, etc, on top of the flashing) to eliminate water sneaking behind the siding and so on. Hope that'll work better...
*given a choice between sill gasket and backer rod, I'd choose the latter. If you've 2 rows of that there will be a void between that'll stop water wicking thru, especially if you use 1/2", say.All the best...
To those who know - this may be obvious. To those who don't - I hope I've helped.
Part of my issue is there is a deck attached (at the third level) the house is 250 miles from home, on the coast and I have spoken to contractors down there that scare me, one guy said that he was using galvanized flashing down there (exposed) with the new deck chemicals and when I asked him If he used any of the rubber type and adhesive backed products (moistop etc.) like I use, he wasn't aware of them, when I asked him if he set doors in pans or flashed up under the doors before he set them he said "I guess I could". In that I don't have a bunch of guys to take down there in case the deck needs to come off, I think I am going to line someone else up to step in if necessary (the contractor that takes care of another window cos. warranty issues) and go down myself and start pulling hardiplank and open her up. My guess is improper or no flashing. Pella replaced the doors (sliders) some 5 years back (before my time) and have not been very helpful. I am going to approach them at the International Builders Show in Orlando but expect nothing . . . If I yank the sliders I don't think anything pella is going back in the hole if I have any say. Can't say they have ever impressed me an now I really don't like them (but a door is only as good as how it was installed which gets me back to the fact that pella messed with them 5 years ago. (Want some cheese to go with this whine). . .Anyway I was soliciting anyone's 2 cents worth and I appreciate yours. Another thing is I have never had a call back on a slider leaking or malfunctioning (except to replace one that had a baseball hit the glass), I tend to believe in over flashing etc. and that it is alot easier to do it right than have to come back or have someone unhappy. Thanks again for your continued comments
is this a brick house? a lot depends on the construction used.let me know. jim
not brick, 3 story frame in coastal conditions with 3 stories of deck (1st fl is slab) with the same layout at each deck. Sliding door in the middle of each with a window flanking about 3 feet away on each side, upper floor is the problem and leaking in at stationary side and down below.
Hardiplank siding with cedar 5/4 around windows and doors which in some areas has been replaced with azek due to improper priming and absorbtion at the end grain, tyvek was used but does not appear to have been taped. . .
Thanks
I've gone back to houses I've built [usually at 7 or 8 years] with this same problem. usually,but not always, on the third level. when a house gets built there are numerous small gaps left in the framing , caused by many things which are both normal and not. the inside of the house has nothing to prevent all these gaps from closing over time. remember there's a gap at the bottom of the drywall? thats to prevent buckling when the gaps between plates and studs close over time. not so the outside wall,rigid sheathing being the norm. as the inside of the house settles the area of floor in way of the ext wall gets tilted toward the inside, taking the door t'hold with it,opening the joint betw3een jamb and t'hold. this starts a leak, which gets the wood wet whicvh causes it compress more making the problem worse. hope you don't mind the long-winded [and probably sometimes confusing] explaination. anyway replace the entire door unit. you'll most likely find that if you just repair any soft subfloor and put in the jamb unit there will be gap between the unit and the subfloor on the inside. this must be cured or you will be right back where you started. door pans can be a wonderfull thing, but only whenthey don't pool water on the roomside of the jamb. hope this helps. jim
Thanks, I'm thinking that the band below the sliding door is shot as well, which means that the deck is going to have to come off as well. At least I can make sure it is flashed right. What is your favorite slider brand. . . and model. This place is a seasonal rental so I am close to starting so that I am ready for the season. . . Thanks again.