I look to you guys/gals because you have been there done that. I am reaching a point in my life where i am considering self-employment/partnership. My partner just leased a F150 to take some of the load off my windstar carting around materials and tools. I am considering leasing a savanna or sprinter, a big work van. My Ford windstar is a 99 and running out of space too quickly and I have already replaced the back springs in it once and is a riding too low. (all seats out just tools)
I could lease a truck and have the cool look, but then have to root around for tools or get a trailer for it, but then have to deal with carting around that. The large van seems to make the most sense, and make more money with it, and then buy a second vehicle for myself in a few years. I know this truck vs van has been discussed to death, but I would like to know what you have done about it. We run a small carpentry company, mostly interiors, window and door installs, trim installs, kitchen installs, and then decks and porches in the summer months, some built-ins as well. Most of our orders are delivered but I have been caught with 16′ of trim on top of the van, my partner usually grabs the 4x8s, and smaller orders, front door etc.
I would like to lease a van/truck as it is a tax deduction for me.
Replies
Before I got on a full time fire dept., I was a full time contractor. Did frame and finish, flooring, and oversaw complete homes.
Best truck I've had, hands down, was a GMC van cut-away. I bought mine 6 mos. before I got the fd job. Got rid of it only because it didn't make sense to have a vehicle that was registered, insured, etc, solely for the business that sat two days a week. I work with a pickup and trailer now, and it works for me because the type of work I do isn't quite the same, but if I were full-timing it, I'd still have it.
12,000 lb gvw, 12' box. I always had the bulk of my material delivered, but when I had to go pick stuff up, size was never an issue. What I liked the best about it was the side compartment boxes, huge compartments that held all the stuff I used daily, without climbing in and out of the back. The back held all the bigger stuff that I wanted to carry and not get wet, ie table saw, slide miter box, etc.
The only downsides were that the mileage wasn't great,(12) and unlike a trailer, which you can leave with your guys if you have to run an errand, we had to take anything they might need out before I left. This was not really much of an issue with me, cause I rarely left the job. ymmv.
I sold mine to a friend who still has it, loves it, doesn't know how he lived without it..blabladdy bla.
Edited 9/29/2008 7:35 pm ET by Bing187
clinkard,
Lease and you acquire debt.. not a good way to start a company.. plus most leases don't work out..
Realize that a a lease is just a way to finance something.. you are buying it.. it's your name on that lease.. you have to pay it off no matter what happens to the business.
If you are absolutely sure that the erms of the lease exactly match your working conditions and can stand the inevitable back chagge when you turn the vehicle in off lease for excess mileage, that little scratch and dent, you got plus your failure to perform the required service at the stated intervals. a lease can be only mildly annoying..
On the other hand you can do the same write off on a purchase. Take the same deduction have a tiny more cash flow and yet own the vehicle outright at the end of the lease.
If you are in love with the word Lease get a $1.00 buyout lease. any other lease you are basically setting yourself up to be screwed..
I know I'm asking for ridicule by admitting this...but about 4 years ago I faced a similar issue, van or truck? I have 2 small boys (future work force) that both needed car seats and I had to bring them to daycare in the morning each day (wifey does the evening pick up). No real work vans would accommodate this and a real 4 door pick me up truck with a decent bed was looking real expensive.So after much thought I decided on a basic Ford mini-van (a Freestar) with the idea that if it didn't work out, I could suck it up and make the change later. I added a nice aluminum ladder / lumber rack to the roof, put on a hitch, and got me a 6 x 10 single axel trailer with good head height. I even took out the rear fold down seat and built a trunk compartment and some rear storage shelves.I have 2 full time employees and do all kinds of remodeling work on mostly older houses...many of our of our projects are good size, full second story additions and the like. We do all of our own demo, framing, exteriors, rock hanging, and finish work. If it's carpentry based, we do it.So far, I have no regrets at all...I rarely find I could use a larger setup. The upfront costs were cheaper, the tires are cheaper, the breaks are cheaper, the gas mileage is better, etc. I don't keep everything in the trailer at once...usually our drywall hanging tools stay at home until we need them, and some of my specialty finish carpentry stuff (kreg jig, sanders, routers, etc.)are kept in my woodshop when not needed on the job, but most things have a place in the van or trailer. I carry 16' foot material or sheet goods on the van rack all the time, and the sliding doors on each side of the mini-van make loading and strapping stuff down a breeze. The big orders (framing package, windows, trim / siding, etc.) all get delivered by the yard, and I rarely need to pick up more than just a few things that were missed or we were short on.I get a funny look sometimes from people, and I have to admit, I get a little jealous when I see other contractors tooling around in their big shiny trucks. But between capital costs, interest, gas, and maintainence costs, I probably save about $6-7,000 a year. The mini-van is white, the trailer is white, both have our company info on them, and the setup actually looks quite professional.
Edited 9/29/2008 9:42 pm ET by averagejoe
averagejoe,
I sure won't make fun of you.. given your circumstances I would have gone that way as well.
my only objection is lease..
Lease is not a smart way to make a long term decision.. lease is just renting something that depreciates as fast as it's used.. Now a 4 year old vehicle shouldn't be used up.. in fact it should be worth at least 40 to 50% of it's opriganl sale price, but that's not how leases are written.. most you will pay 80 or 90% of the price of the vehicle and then turn it in and start over.. losing at least 30 or 40% of the value of the vehcle in spite of paying 90% of the price..
Hey, averagejoe,I'm with frenchy -- I'd be the last to make fun of you. I've seen some sweet minivan rigs, too.Me, I've got a Supercab F-150.Big rig, right? Wrong. My kids grumble in the back seat when we drive to the UP for a camping trip. In fact, they've banished my wife to that too-small seat, now that they're taller than she is.And the bed is 6'6", too small to carry a door safe from the weather.But it's tricky to parallel-park, since it's longer than the vehicles the parking spaces were designed for.So, let's see, what's my score?:1) Too small
2) Too small
3) Too big Hell, I might as well drive a minivan, and get better mileage! AitchKay
I vote for the sprinter type van. I have had pickups w/ caps, and vans. right now I am driving a chevy express 3500. I like it. it hauls all I need it to. keeps the stuff secure and dry. but climbing around in it would be nicer with more headroom. besides I hear the sprinter gets batter gas mileage. I'm actually considering a small trailer to tow with the van so I can leave it on jobs with materials, etc.
Purchase is definitely the way to go. Buy used but not too used. look at auctions. my van was a new hamshire electric company vehicle.
good luck
"it aint the work I mind,
It's the feeling of falling further behind."
Bozini Latini
http://www.ingrainedwoodworking.com
i faced the same decision this march van or truck. most guys like that nice truck with power but i choose to be practical even though i wanted the truck. i ended up buying a ford van that runs good and is in great shape with some miles for 5,300 if you shop around i think you can do even better than that all my tools are organized and dry and i dont have to carry them in and out of the garage i have racks for the long stuff on top it works for me
My pickup is about 5 years old and its showing the signs of the work we do.I would be a bit concerned about the termes of the lese in reguard to weare and tear.