I have to have a basement floor removed and replaced four to five inches lower as part of a high end remodel project. Any advice out there that would be helpful besides scheduling an appt. with the chiropractor?
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Saw that this am. Guess you don't want to hear about jacking up the house...
You presumably know there may be footing issues. Often slabs can be broken up with the largest sledge you can swing. Probably on your knees there. Jackhammering is really hard on the hands.
To avoid disposal, advertise "urbanite" on Freecycle and CraigsList. Surprising number of people interested in concrete recycle.
PAHS Designer/Builder- Bury it!
Are you the owner, the contractor, or the grunt?
or all three? The level of advice appropriate is dependent on your position in the chain of command.
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Piffen, Thanks for the read. I'm the general on this and the house is a two story brick, so raising isn't an option. I know that I may run into footing issues. That's why I'm putting up this post, to see if there is any good ways to handle the footing edges if they are in the way. There is a set of stairs as well as a exterior door to contend with. Plus, I've got to support the water heater while the new floor is being poured. I think I've got that worked out with a ledger bolted to the foundation wall and a couple chains connected to a two ton hoist supported by the floor joists above. Then a temporary floor under the heater. But it's the footins and columns that I'm worried about.
Any chance the slab is poured inside the foundation walls, and is keeping them from slipping inward?"Put your creed in your deed." Emerson
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
No I think the key in the footing should cover that, maybe even some rebar connecting the wall to the footing. I'm worried that I'll try to dig out four to five inches and then the footing will be exposed at the edges. I think I could bring the walls in to fix that, but what about the columns?
Just some general thoughts.
I think before proceeding that you =n3ed some test digs with an engineer. Core sample slab and footing below to see what condition and size of footing is. You could probably cut the footing off 2-4" inside the concrete wall (or is this true brick old construction with structural brick all the way to footer?) and then frame new wall to the inside of the concrete that would adress the gap when you droip the floor.For holding structure when pouring floor, we use heavy metal telejack posts set on a concrete cookie dropped down below the new crete level, then wrap the base of it so after pouring, we can lift the metal pole out and then grout the hole that is left. That could be a way to remove the columns while you dig and pour - cut through the existing slab abd dig down enough to get a cookie in for a metal post and set it. If there will be structural walls, you can place these where the walls will be and just leave in place after the new pour.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Wouldn't the perimeter footing drains become an issue if the floor was dropped too much?
Or doesn't this place have such drains?
All I could do is assume from what we do here, Pete. that is partly why I suggested he do a core saple or small demo hole to study out what exists now. Here, we would have an 8-10" deep footer and the perimdrain would be on the exterior at the base of the footer.So if he dropped a salb so that is no more than about 6" below top of footer, he could be OK. Of cou4rse he should also add drainage to a sump pit inside if there is any sign of water
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That is a lot of work for 5 inches. As far as breaking it out a couple of jackhammers. Your also gonna want to rent,buy or borrow a conveyor to bring the material out. If not your labourers will quit in about 5 minutes. You say you have an outside entrance into the basement. If possble get a skid steer down there witha breaker on it and break the floor up, then use the bucket to scoop it all out. Good luck. Glad its you and not me.
at the footer, you'd want to cut before breaking with the jackhammer, or risk the fractures running the wrong way through it.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
They have installed perimeter drain tile to sumps in the corner that will be lowered as well.
Thanks for reply. The house is brick veneer with 8" foundation walls. City inspector already warned me about cutting in to footings, so I am out of luck there. An engineer may propose same solution and could back it up with numbers, to convince building dept. otherwise. Thanks for column idea, That should work. I'm hoping to only drop to the level of footings for about four inches. The reason is the extreme slope that is on the floors now , and the fact that the homeowner is spending a ton of money to turn the lower level into nice usable space. We're taking out HVAC and replacing it with Unico to add headroom. The house is in an area that is within walking distance from the county seat, and the cost for the whole project is most likely less than their yearly bonus.
How high is the ceiling now? How high do you hope it to be? That's a whole lot of work for 5". Eh?
The main reason is to level the floor really and not so much height. That's why three or four inches is "OK" and would then be about 96" throughout. Thanks for the interest and I really appreciate the help. Sorry it took so long to answer
We currently have some footers that are about a foot too shallow for frost and have to fix it before a kitchen redo. We try to place supports under the footer that can be left in place. Perhaps something like this would give you the extra height needed.
We use a threaded Simpson adjustable post base and 11"x11" concrete block and under the existing footers about every 3'. The blocks even come with the hole already drilled.
The hangers are rated to support 3200 lbs with a 5/8" threaded section and 3/4" threaded models are something like 3600 lbs. The threaded connection allows a great deal of upward pressure to be put on the existing footer. We crank on the nut so it's tight as possible with a 12" wrench and it hasn't raised or lowered the existing wall. Additional partial turns are possible after the ground compresses for a few hours and the next day. Simpson also makes a big square washer that we trust a bit more in this application than the smallish washer that somes with them.
The ears above the threaded section of the base are simply hammered over since it presses directly against the bottom of the existing footer.
At least for a one story brick project this works well if only one wall is supported at a time. The threaded rod isn't the most secure so I don't know that I'd trust this to support more than one wall at a time. For a two story I'd feel more comfortable adding more blocks, but that's getting expensive if it's a large area.
We also like this bracket when footer pads are under a slab. A little tape on the threaded section and loads are passed from the post, through the slab directly to the footer.
View Image
At least for our project this is working quite well.
Best of luck
Beer was created so carpenters wouldn't rule the world.
Just read your post and I appreciate your input. The post idea may be helpful to me
VATOM wrote: "To avoid disposal, advertise "urbanite" on Freecycle and CraigsList. Surprising number of people interested in concrete recycle."
Would it be feasable to hire a concrete cutter and saw it into slabs and reuse it or sell it for use in "stone" walls? Obviously access to the basement is necessary for removal of slabs, but that's an issue even if you just bust it up.
I am bringing a contractor in to break and pour the new floor so old material will be his responsibility. Thanks for the interest.