Ive been pricing matrerial for several days days now figurring different jobs
Lowes seems to be 10 percent cheaper than anybody or more .
That finally pizzed the lumber yard off I use . Ive given them every opportunity to just match them but they cant do it . I ordered a truck load of roofing yesterday as we have had a hail storm the size of oranges.
Be a price leader
Tim
Replies
Congrats!!!
That's sure not the case here. Lowes is the one 10-20% higher. They aim for Harry and seem to be doing quite well as the place is packed.
They offer the usual price match but the service is so poor it's just not worth going after.
Here Lowes cant match the price of shingles. Lowes carries OC and McCoys carries Tamko. Its about 4 dollars a square less to buy the Tamko.
If your buying that much try googling Tamko. their out of Dallas and you might get them wholesale.
On another note, Lowes did match (almost) the truckload price of cellulose that I usually get from Houston and will drop ship it in Victoria for me. Which makes it cheaper in the long run.
The lumber yard tried to use the brand on me thing.
The shingles Lowes has here is Tamko. They said its a cheaper shingle but for rentals , I dont care. Im not even sure if its less of a shingle and he could not proove any different . They both have the same warranties.
First though he said we cant compete with them because they buy so much as he knew they were shipping train car loads. I said all that means is everyone should buy from Lowes so he left that pretty quick. He told me they order truck loads and Lowes has train car loads so they should be cheaper .
Then he went to quality and I disagreed as the last time I had a problem I couldnt get the shingles made up buying from him. Thats when he quit that .
Finally , on his best price quoted , Lowes had him beat 3.00 per square delilivred. .
Tim
Edited 4/18/2006 9:41 am by Mooney
Hey Tim,
for truckload quantities, have to admit that price can be a huge factor and the big boxes will deliver the stuff just like a lot of yards. But, a good yard will also bring a couple of helpers and a truck with an unloading crane to put the stuff wherever you want it (including into a window opening upstairs -- who wants to carry, say, long sheets of drywall up a flight or 2 of stairs?). That is worth something. Only you can decide how much it's worth to you.
For smaller quantities that I pick up myself, most of my local yards will load my truck for me. Everything ready for blast off as soon as I've paid. That is worth something.
Local yards can help with engineering questions. Big boxes -- are you kidding? That's worth something.
Only you can decide what good service is worth to you. If you don't need what the yards can do for you, or it's not worth what they want for it in terms of higher price, then it's smart to save the cost of the extra service level they provide and buy from a big box for sure. Why pay for something you don't need.
If it's that the yard you use doesn't provide better service for the more money they charge, then definitely change yards.
"Let's get crack-a-lackin" --- Adam Carolla
Good point you brought up.
Ya gotta find a way to beat the system every now and then.
Several years ago I hung and finished drywall for a living . Mostly. The big boxes were just opening up and I strolled into a new one . I noticed the drywall was .06 cents cheaper cash and carry then delivery. .10 cents cheaper than the lumber yard I use delivered to me . I thought Im going to the job anyway I might as well start hauling rock so I bought a flat bed trailer . I made a deal with the hangers to hang off the trailer instead of stocking it but if they didnt get hung out it would have to be unloaded in the house unless they did and it was left over then tarp it . They did it starting for a penny per foot and went to two cents. That left .08cents for me and I was there anyway. I just started an hour earliar than they did which is common for a boss anyway.
When I need a yards equipment they get the call. The yard I use , used to have a lift to put shingles on top of the roof by conveyor for 1.00 per sq but they SOLD it . I would have paid a 1.00 per bundle if they would have asked. Then an old man like me can roof. <G>
Tim
"They said its a cheaper shingle but for rentals , I dont care."Well, if you don't give a shid about quality, why are you even talking to the yard?$3.00 a square! Wow. What's that? $100 per roof?Remember that savings when the lumberyard is closed and your only source for everything is the big box.Rich BeckmanAnother day, another tool.
20 sqs per house average @3.00 per is only 60.00 x 7 houses equals 420.00.
IN torndado alley we never pay for roofs over a 15 yr period. The insurance company does. Well we do but what ever. The best odds figgure out on a 15 yr plan.
Warranties are the same as I said and I keep all bills on each house .
Why didnt the lumber yards have the cheap prices when they had all the business? Why didnt they have every thing we need instead of ordering it and playing the truck game ? How many times did we hear that the truck didnt come in? Or that it was back ordered? One time a friend builder got so sick of it said I would pay you this month but the money truck didnt come in. Do you remember the old days?
Tim
"Why didnt the lumber yards have the cheap prices when they had all the business?"
Well, more often than not, if the quality is the same, my yard isn't much more (if any) expensive than Lowes. And once the delivery charge is factored in, my yard is often cheaper. Once you correlate for quality of the product, then Lowes is usually more expensive.
"Why didnt they have every thing we need instead of ordering it and playing the truck game?"
I agree that there is stuff I wish my yard kept on hand that they don't. But I know if I did more volume than the pitance that I do they would carry whatever I wanted them to carry. They did come up with a sample of window sealing tape for me when I complained enough that I can't find one that sticks to anything. If it works, they'll have that for me. Truck game?? I'm not familier with it.
"How many times did we hear that the truck didnt come in?"The few times I've heard that I was told what they had done to get the product in ASAP. I've had to complain that they shouldn't do anything to speed it up without checking with me to make sure I really needed it that quick.
"Do you remember the old days?"Aparently not. But I've only been in the biz for ten years or so.Regarding warranties. Warranties do not necessarily reflect the quality of the product. Equal warranties do not always mean equal quality.Maybe your local yard just sucks. I'm sure there are some that do.If you are comfortable having only the big boxes to purchase from, then it is no skin off your back if the local yard closes.Rich BeckmanAnother day, another tool.
I just reroofed my ranch house. Not a big job but "my" local lumber yard beat Lowes and HD by $3.00 a BUNDLE! Delivered and off loaded where and when I needed them. Service and Price...got to love it!
I worked in my dads lumber yard and later I ran it .
For us it was a money game . We tried to get sold at least half the load before we acrtually bought it. I could order a full load with none sold but I had to place sell it with in 30 days.
Often times trucks are ordered when they are not routed. They are waiting on a full load. Prices are locked on a load , then the retail sells it before it loaded.
Tim
Normally I buy from salvage lumber yards where the savings are closer to 12 dollars per sq but they didnt have any three tab.
The colors and the sizes can be irregular but the warranty is the same .
edit to add; On two of the roofs that got hit were salvage yard shingles and were irregulars. Some are taller than others or a pinch longer. The estimator gave me the same price for them replaced. Im sure he didnt know it for the shingles are gauged from the bottom and who can tell a 1/16?
Thats the rental business Rich.
Tim
Edited 4/18/2006 11:29 am by Mooney
Hmmm. Thats just the opposite of here. I guess a hurricane through the middle of town makes a lot of difference. I dont know what the price difference was before Rita as I havent really installed shigles in about ten years. After Rita thats all there was though.
IMHO, Tamko is a better shingle and company than OC. That's not to say OC is bad, but I like Tamko better.Why is it every time I need to get somewhere, I get waylaid by jackassery?
http://grantlogan.net/
I'll second that. Since the hurricane about one third of the OC 30 year shingles have been damaged. Not a problem though with the 20 year.
Havent had any problem with Tamko
Actually Tamko is headquarted in Joplin, MO. Which is a sones throw from Tim's back yard. If you use a small stone and big catapult.
Thats true, but I was talking about the plant they had there.
Wasnt sure where he gets his from.
It amazes me how everyone talks about how service and quality is more important than price. But they don't appear to back up those words with action.
I've been on the other side of this coin - Working for a truss plant that was owed by a lumberyard, and trying to compete with the big boxes. Sometimes the big boxes were selling OSB for the same price we were buying it for - In truckloads, mill direct. It's impossible to compete with them on price.
I'd say your small lumberyards were doing the right thing by standing their ground. No one can stay in business by selling stuff at or below their cost.
Sometimes you're lucky.
Sometimes you're just good 'n lucky.
That finally pizzed the lumber yard off I use .
Lowes matching said lumberyard in the service dept.?
I wouldn't expect my local guy to be able to match prices with a Big Box.
Then again, were I to place a shingle order with them, I would expect them to tell me if the manufacturer were discontinueing the line in the near future.
be fooled once.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
I would expect them to tell me if the manufacturer were discontinueing the line in the near future.
Funny you should mention that.
Did a roof thr week of Thanksgiving. Owens Corning Alpine White 30 yr shingles.
Got ready to do the garage last month and guess what? OC dont make that color right now due to Katrina. Rita, etc. I had to scramble around most of the Lowes within several hundred miles here to find 15 squares.
I have to deal with Lowes because clients always go there to pick color, shape, size,etc. But here I prefer to shop at McCoys unless I'm doig commercial work. Then I have to cut price when I can
Happened to me a few years back. HO chose a dirt cheap roof shingle from HD. I measured up and had six squares delivered to the house.
My bad for ordering a bundle and a half short.....but the roof was pretty cut up, and I knew it was highly unlikely I'd be working with this shingle in the future, so I didn't want to store any leftovers.
Went back to HD at the end of the week to pick up the two bundles for capping....nadda!
Asked the "Pro-desk" when they'd be getting another shipment and was told the line had been discontinued. I had bought the last six squares.
"ARE YOU SH!TTING ME?!"
I ordered the last six squares of a product being discontinued, and no one thought it was worth mentioning?
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
Oh that is the chit's, gotta love those (Pro's) at HD ever so helpful.
No I dont plan on any extra service with them as that always comes through the reps anyway. As long as they deliver the shingles I will pay the bill. I have a business account with them so its hard to lose money from their service since I pay later.
I try to order a couple sqs extra per job and put them in the warehouse as I do the same thing on paint , tile , carpet , etc. with the rentals. Theres all kinds of things in that building like that .
Be lookin for a chicken house 40x400. <G>
I did find seconds architectural for 24.95 per sq yesterday but passed.
Tim
I found Lowes for lumber is best price.
However you have to be careful on the hardware. they tend to be more pricier on those items (clips, straps, nails, caulk etc) that stuff adds up quick. The quality of lumber (SYP in my case) does not appear however to be consistently as high at Lowes as the Lumberyard.
Our Lowes staff is EXTREMELY willing to go out of thier way to assist ,the downside is they are under staffed and really don't know anything.
Funny thing is I have been working with two lumberyards as well and they too are willing to help, and I never have to wait for assistance but whenever I have a question, no one can answer it there either (so I end up here on BT, then go back an order what I need).
Overall I can get what I need and save a buck by utilizing all forms of suppliers, but hey I have the time so it's worth it to me.
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WWPD
Speaking of prices...
I needed some 1/2" ceiling rated rock. The only place to get that is the local big (not box) supplier.
Would you believe $23.52 per 12' sheet? The price has jumped $10 per sheet since the last time I bought and there's another price increase coming next month. AND, it can't be the shipping cost because we have a plant right here in town.
Ralph at that price I would have had to check 5/8s fire code at the big boxes. Its a better product.
Tim