In my very early thoughts about how I would like to add a second floor laundry room to my home, I’ve wondered about how to best keep the noise of the washer/dryer to a minimum, since it will be across the hall from what will most likely be a baby’s room in the future, and above living space.
Everything from buying newer/quieter appliances (less likely) to insulating the walls and floor of the room and using a solid wood door, and some sort of vibration-absorbing material for the floor. So if the room is well-insulated, small and the door will be kept shut for noise, will the dryer vented to the outside have enough makeup air to dry properly? Assuming air will come from outside, what kind of connection would keep this airtight, and should I worry about drying efficiency if the makeup air is cold?
I’d like to hear thoughts on both topics: keeping it quiet and the makeup air issue.
Thanks, PJ
Replies
Do a google search for anti-vibration pads to place under your washer and dryer. I have them and they make a big difference in a 2nd floor Laundry Room.
Don't forget to put a sheet metal pan w/ a drain to daylight under the washer (don't ask me how I know to recommend this)! I'd suggest two layers of vibration damping: under the pan and under the washer/dryer.
Good tips all, especially double layer of drywall. Drain pan for the washer is a must have, but I hadn't thought about just dumping it to "daylight" - assuming you mean to the outside? I figure cold air issues might be worrisome in that situation. Easy enough to just tie it into the normal drain.No suggestions on makeup air?PJ
You'll need to add a trap if you tie in... how often you gonna pour water down the drain to keep the trap full?
Daylight drain Troy Sprout
Socialism in general has a record of failure so blatant that only an intellectual could ignore or evade it."-- Thomas Sowell
Vegetable oil in the trap with the water will keep it from evaporating. I think it's a trick used in basement drain traps
PJ
There is a unit that adds water by the drop, to the trap, to maintain it...buic
"There is a unit that adds water by the drop, to the trap, to maintain it"
Trap primers. A thread on here a few months ago sure made them seem more trouble than they are worth if they can be avoided. A better solution might be one of those waterless traps that have a rubber membrand that opens up from water pressure.
Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PA
Pardon me for asking everyone but...............
Dont you think that if you actually wash the clothes you work in once in a while the trap is going to stay full??
maybe in a camp setting that you only get to evry few weeks or something but......
You guys do wash your clothes once in a while dont you???
:).....
They're talking about the trap under the washer pan - Not the one in the drain that the washer discharges into.
Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us. [Bill Watterson]
Well, they are talking about the trap in the floor emergency overflow pan, not the washer drain. Unless you wash your clothes on a rock, that pan should stay dry pretty much forever, as would the trap, unless you primed it on occasion.(Oops. BossHog beat me to it.)
Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PA
Edited 4/13/2007 11:49 am ET by MikeHennessy
Sometimes ya opens yer "trap" without thinking!!
OOOOOOOOOoooooooooooppsss.
I need to go do a few loads for you guys and stick me head in as well. A moment afetr I hit post I felt a few torchings coming on. No need to be so polite.
Yer hilarious.Scott.Always remember those first immortal words that Adam said to Eve, “You’d better stand back, I don’t know how big this thing’s going to get.”
Seen it done with the waterless trap to daylight (basement floor). Easy to see if you have a problem. Plan to do it on the next laundry redo.Troy Sprout
Socialism in general has a record of failure so blatant that only an intellectual could ignore or evade it."-- Thomas Sowell
We put in a 2nd floor laundry, purchased a PVC floorpan unit, "Floodsaver", I think, abvertised in one of the trade mags. Very nice, the wall panel has the recess for the elect./water/drain hook up. Just ran a 1 1/4' pvc drain down in to the basement and dumped it into the floor drain. NO TRAP! unless you want a stinky room next to the baby.
Ours is next to the bedroom, anti viberation pads would be nice, hear the noise in the room below more that upstairs.
Just a thought. I'm wondering if a small dehumidifier in the laundry room wouldn't be a good idea.
Serve two purposes.....the first being its intended , the second....have it drain into the flood pan and keep the trap filled.
J. D. ReynoldsHome Improvements
Its called a "trap seal primer"
http://www.trapgaurd.com
That's http://www.trapguard.com
If I had a washer on 2nd floor, I'd also check into installing Floodstop (mine is on ground floor and I have it on my list).
They also have a setup for waterheaters.Had a customer (Sears) needing a service call. Seems his timer stuck on fill!!!!! Needless to say $1,000s of dollars in damage. Floodstop, when it senses water, shuts off the water at the hookup.I found them on the RC Williams website and I know several plumbing companies in this area advertise them.
Pete in Plano,TX
In addition to the pan and drain, you might consider adding an automatic shutoff unit on the supply lines. These have electrically activated valves for the water hoses. If the washer isn't running, no water comes out. They also have a sensor that shuts them if it gets wet. This is great if a hose breaks. Expensive, though.http://www.wattswater.com/watts/showdetl.cfm?&DID=9&Product_ID=457&CATID=61George Patterson, Patterson Handyman Service
There is also Floodstop. Easy to find. Local plumber advertises installing them.
Works for washers and they also have one for water heaters.Pete
Good suggestions above...
I think maybe the insulation thing was created by the insulation industry to sell their products. If you talk to people who have gone the insulation route, you will hear about mixed results at best. Maybe coupled with the below methods.
Regarding blocking sound, mass and mechanical isolation is what you want.
Mass - like maybe a concrete floor and double 5/8" drywall walls, Next, a solid core door - not a hollow core one that is built the same way a gutar is.
Isolation - for the walls, install resilient metal channel on, and perpendicular to, the bare studs. This helps sound vibration from being transferred through the walls. It is sometimes called hat channel because it is shaped like this: _/-_ excuse the crude drawing but I think you might get the idea...
We just got an LG frontloader washer/dryer set. Man , I can't believe the difference in noise levels between these and our old machines. These are really quite. Very cool. The only exception is that the valves on the washer seem to be faster acting than the old ones and I needed to install hammer arrestors to quiet that down. These are on a concrete floor so vibration is not a problem. I've heard it can be if your floors are not solid.
Mike Hennessy
Pittsburgh, PA
Use solid core door to laundry room.
I've seen make-up air supplies in mech. rms. that have a trap in the run to limit cold air infiltration. Looks similar to a plumbing trap. Maybe an HVAC guy could chime in here to comment on the feasability of such a set-up.
Man , I can't believe the difference in noise levels between these and our old machines. These are really quite.
Really? I've got a Siemens (same as Bosch) FL Washer/Dryer and the washer, while it's quiet during the actual wash, it rather noisy during the spin cycle. It actually sounds like someone's warming up a LearJet in the laundry room. : )
As for soundproofing, in our new house's laundry/mudroom we're doing a solid-core door and I had our insulation contractors dense-pack the walls with fiberglass. I'm also looking into the isolation padding mentioned.
Jason
"Really? I've got a Siemens (same as Bosch) FL Washer/Dryer and the washer, while it's quiet during the actual wash, it rather noisy during the spin cycle. It actually sounds like someone's warming up a LearJet in the laundry room."
LOL. I guess it depends on what you're used to! These machines are WAY quieter than the conventional units they replaced. Actually, the noisiest part is at the very beginning of the cycle where the water cycles on and off a few times -- makes the plumbing "thump" a bit, even with hammer arrestors.
Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PA
There is a product for sale here called "Quiet Rock" It appears to be laminated sheetrock with something between the sheets, Thats all I know about it but I plan to look into for the next media room we build.
They have THX certified, if I recall correctly, that is about an inch thick made with several layers of 1/4 and that something in between.
They also had one that appeared to be 1/2" from two layers.
that and possibly RC channel would probably help.
For sound insulation, I have heard that mass-loaded vinyl is better than two layers of drywall. Not sure about the special drywall or drywall on channel. The idea of solid core door is good. I know someone who put exterior-type steel doors with gaskets on his bedrooms to reduce noise transmission.
For makeup air, maybe you could run the duct a ways so that the air has time to get heated a little by the ambient air as it makes its way to the dryer. I was also wondering about running the makeup air in a duct that surrounds the exhaust air duct--sort of a double walled duct, the way they double wall flues on wood burners. I don't know if the outgoing exhaust on a dryer would be warm enough to help temper the incoming air.
"I was also wondering about running the makeup air in a duct that surrounds the exhaust air duct--sort of a double walled duct, the way they double wall flues on wood burners."Wow, I hadn't even thought of that one. Would be pretty simple as the dryer would only be a few feet from exiting the house.PJ
I have used the mass loaded vinyl in an elevator equipment room. The stuff really does a good job, even though we couldn't install it correctly. I think we had a 35% db reduction just hanging the loose blankets on the walls.
One caution when using the stuff. Get help, it weighs a ton and is awkward to handle.
RC channel run perpendicular tp the studs and 5/8" drywall with dense packed cell may be less costly than the mass loaded vinyl.
I think both FHB and JLC have done articles on sound proofing techniques in the past year or so.
Dave
get rid of the washer and dryer.“Ilsa, I’m no good at being noble, but it doesn’t take much to see that the problems of three little people don’t amount to a hill of beans in this crazy world”.
I think both FHB and JLC have done articles on sound proofing techniques in the past year or so.
I think so too, one of those (or both?) is where I read about the mass-loaded vinyl.
I'm doing an addition with a laundry. A sound engineer friend of the HO told him that a 2x6 wall with 2x4 studs staggered side to side and woven fiberglass batts would give the most effective bang for the buck.
We're also going to use an exterior door, sill sealer, caulk at plates, and at sheetrock floor and ceiling intersections, just in case. Shelter Nerd described a make-up air damper you could search for.
The weather was hot, a-nearly 90 degrees.
The man standin' next to me, his head was exploding,
Well, I was prayin' the pieces wouldn't fall on me.
http://www.soundproofing101.com/index.htm
http://www.acousticalsolutions.com/education/index.asp
http://www.quietsolution.com/
http://www.acousticalsurfaces.com/acousti_board/acousti_board.htm