Didn’t know quite how to title this so it made sense.
Yesterday I was just finishing installing the 5th of ten replacement windows–the kind that are inserted where the old sashes were–when the homeowner discovered something I suspected but didn’t let stop me:
Since the new windows have smaller openings, she can no longer take the permanent storm windows out through the inside to clean them. Turns out that is the only way to remove the permanent storms and screens, other than unscrewing the frames from the outside. So after a minute of panic on my part, she agreed that it was more important to have the new inserts that are themal pane, than to accomodate some flimsy storm windows. But I should have told her as soon as I suspected it that the old storms would not come through the new openings. It’s one of those things that sort of filters up into your consciuos mind and then dissipates before you think to discuss it.
So now I have additional work–taking down the useless storm windows. Personally, I would keep them and just clean them (if I ever bothered) by reaching through the opening after taking the new sashes out and cleaning the old ones in place, then doing the same from the outside. Maybe should convince her to do that. The storm screen must come out in any case. (I could have taken them out first, before installing the inserts, had I thought about it–and will do so on the remaining five!)
I had told the homeowner that the new windows had their own screens, but she said we’d just remove one or the other. I hate to remove the Pella screens, because they are prety nice.
Replies
Well, now you know. File that in with all the other information crammed in there. Hope you don't get like me and find yourself running out of room in there.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Quittin' Time
Might want to check with the window manufacturer about those storm windows being left in place. I seem to remember something about the air in between it and the new window being superheated in the right circumstances and causing damage to the new sashes.
She certainly doesn't need them anymore.
Eric
I Love A Hand That Meets My Own,
With A Hold That Causes Some Sensation.
Usually the new repacement windows eliminate the need for storm windows. Storms were only needed because the old sashes were single glazing. They actually added a degree of thermal efficiency. Now all the windows available are double glazed.
Get rid of 'em
Good point--also, the old storms have screens and we don't need two sets of screens on each window. It would add a sort of dead air space, but as you say, the new ones being double pane will be good enough. I would have had to at least temporarily remove the old windows in order to seal them from the outside. (Going to wait for warmer weather to do that.)
The funny thing is, she decided on this type of replacement that keeps the old frames because I wouldn't have to take down the old storm windows. At any rate, with these, I can wait to go outside to remove the storms until the weather is better. It has been cold here (-4 all the way up to 25 for a couple weeks, but Friday had a heat wave of 41 for the high), but this week we're supposed to have three or four days of rain and then get below freezing at the end of the week. Not something I want to be out in fooling around on a ladder with windows!
take the screens off the new windows, that is standard practice and they have no purpose.
Didn't know that was standard paractice--definitely don't need two screens! I don't see why she can't clean inside of storms from inside and go outside to clean outsides. It's sort of a PITA, but beats throwing them away--they're only a few years old. (I know she doesn't want to have to go outside to clean windows, but maybe could hire it done--or just spray them with TSP and hose them off.)
One of the reasons most people do replacement windows, or should I say, one of the things they look forward to is losing those damn storm windows.
THROW 'EM OUT!!!!I Love A Hand That Meets My Own,
With A Hold That Causes Some Sensation.
[email protected]
Danno - Why not leave the storms up if the lady will agree. Double glazing is nice, but triple glazing is better...
On many of the newer windows it's possible to completely remove both sashes with relative ease. This should result in an opening wide enough to allow the storms to be removed from the inside, though it may be necessary to add new handles, latches, or some such, to make removal easier.
Of course, the problem with overheating should be considered, especially if there's any plastic on the exterior of the new windows, and/or if the frames have a dark color.
Pardon my late reply and reply to ALL rather than individuals--Prospero isn't notifying me of replies for some reason. Swell.
To Dan H: The replacements fit in where just the old sashes were (didn't remove old frames) and since new frames as well as sashes fit where there were only sashes, the new sashes are narrower--too narrow to get the old storm sashes back through.
To Doug@es and others: I thought more dead air space would be good--didn't think about overheating and yes, they are vinyl. I have on all but the first four, removed the glass from the storms and will take off the frames when it's better weather. Lady doesn't like idea of just removing new sashes to clean insides of storms and cleaning outsides from outside.
edit: I see Prospero notified me this morning of the messages I replied to last night.
Edited 2/8/2005 7:31 am ET by Danno
Danno
Is the new window vinyl? If so you better take the old storm off, the heat build up between the two will damage the new windows.
I think that is even part of the instructions, not that I would ever read them!
Doug