I have to tile 2 rooms, the foryer and the bathroom. I have a couple of questions about both.
First the foryer: The floor is a poured cement slab. it was a crack in 1 corner of it. Can i just lay the tile right on the cement or does something have to be put down first? What type of mastic do i use? And lastly we want a border around the perimeter. How do you go about laying a tile floor out with a border?
The bathroom: Just 1 question about this. The bathroom tile in the house we just bought is old and nasty. I was told i can just tile right over it. Is this true? What kind of prep needs to be done? Oh and 1 more thing. If we do tile over the floor does the toliet have plumbing have to be raised up or will it still seal?
Replies
I have heard that you can tile over old tile, but I wouldn't do it. Yes, if you do manage to add another layer of tile, you will need to do something to get the potty to seal properly. Maybe an extended wax ring will work, or one of those new rubber rings.
You should put something ovwer the crack. There are fabric products as well as paint-type products that are sold for crack isolation purposes ... check with your local tile store to see what they stock. I have seen one product in Lowes that will probably work.
One thought that I have had ... and I wonder if my logic is right ... if it's an old crack, and hasn't changed since the house was built ... I wonder if maybe the foundation has stabilized and you coyld tile right over the crack. Probably not.
Anyway, as to the mastic, buy a bag of thinset and mix your own. It is really easy, and the material is relatively inexpensive. I think Lowes sells Mapei Ultraflex thinset in a 50# bag, which is good for 50-75 sf, for about $12.
Ah, the border and the layout. What you need to do is determine the size of the field tiles and the size of the border tiles, and sketch a layout on a piece of paper. If you could post a diagram here, you'll get lots of cheap advice.
Whenever you are asked if you can do a job, tell'em "Certainly, I can!" Then get busy and find out how to do it. T. Roosevelt
Thanks for the help. THe crack could very well have just been a settleing crack. The house was built in the late 60s but how could i tell. doesnt seemed to have changed in the last 3 months i have owned the house.
I will have to get the dimensions of the room with some pics and a sketch. As for the tile over tile i normally would rip it up but its such a small bathroom and i dont plan on living here for more then 6 years so it should last me that long. But is i wanted to take it out would i have to replace the plywood underneath? Is it really hard to remove the tile? Thanks again for the help.
Which is more likely, you will regret fixing the crack or you will regret not fixing the crack?
That's my test, your milage may vary.
The awful thing is that beauty is mysterious as well as terrible. God and the devil are fighting there, and the battlefield is the heart of man.
- Fyodor Dostoyevski
Edited 8/2/2004 9:30 am ET by fn_benthayer
hey crepitus...
dont know much about tile, but i do know you can get a lot of good answers over here..
http://johnbridge.com/vbulletin/index.php
i believe there are a few people here that do double time on breaktime and johnbridge...
Look at the crack and see if it is vertically displaced. Is one side higher than the other? If they are even, you don't need to fix the crack. If one side is 1/8" or more different, you should fix the crack. In between, you will have to make a judgement.
I would use a product of isolate the new tile from the slab, especially since you do have movement. We use a Schluter product called Ditra. It is about 1/4" thick. I am sure that there are similar products on the market.
I probably would either take up the tile in the bath or clean it up and live with it. But that's just me. If the existing tile is solid, you could use a product like Ditra which would even the tile surface out and isolate it (somewhat) from movement in the existing floor. If any of the existing tiles are cracked and moving under pressure, you should remove these while you have the chance.
For your foyer layout, here's what I do when laying out a tile job.
I get accurate dimensions of the room and lay it out on paper first, so I know how much tile to buy.
I'll describe a rectangular room, but if it's more complicated, just extend these concepts. Mark the exact centerlines of the room in both directions. Work out your layout in one quadrant, the others will be the same. Lay a tile in the corner of the center lines, spaced away from the center line by a difference of half the width of your contemplated grout joint. Precisely lay out a row of tiles along each of the two perpendicular lines, accounting for grout spacing, from the center to about where you want the inside of the border to be. Then lay out the width of the border. If the border goes all the way to the wall, see if it is about the same distance from the wall in both directions. If it is much different, you can shift either row of tiles a half tile's width to one side or the other. That is, the center tile will straddle the center line in one direction rather than be beside it. One or the other arrangement will look better. That's the one to go with. Then you can adjust the last little bit by tweaking the grout joint widths on one row or the other so the border comes out just perfect.
If you have large tiles, this may not be possible. It's easier with smaller tiles, and also with handmade tiles, which take a wider grout joint. A wider joint makes varying them easier to pull off without noticing.
The key here is that you want only full tiles in the field between the borders, if there is any way at all for the border to land where you want.
If your border is only a stripe, and you will have more field tiles outside the border, it's less critical that the distance from the outside edge of the border to the wall be the same in the two directions.
I would never cut the field tiles to make the layout work. Partial tiles look bad in the middle. All the takeup should be with the border or with slight adjustments to the grout joints. If you are using large field tiles, and just can't make it work, you can install the field tiles on the diagonal, then cutting won't look bad, so long as the pattern is centered.
The final judge is really does it look right. If it looks hokey or fudged, try a different approach.
If you give more details, such as approximate tile and room size, what the border will be like, etc. we can give a more specific description.
Take your time. It took me six weeks working nights to lay out and install 1103 individual tiles in a foyer, but the results were stunning.
http://forums.taunton.com/tp-breaktime/messages?msg=38882.6