Bought some sand the other day to replenish the sand box for DS. I noticed a disclaimer and warning label about this sand containing Silica which causes lung cancer, etc…… They are selling this in bags as play ground sand with pictures of children on the label. They claim no responsibility after purchase.
They say to keep it wet to keep the dust down. So now I picture DS with a respirator while playing in the sand box.
Does real sand, like builders sand. The kind we use to mix mortar contain silica? What about the sand God made at the beach?
Maybe I need to change it out……..
Why would Lowes even take on something like that? Sounds like a crazy liability risk.
“Some people wonder all their lives if they’ve made a difference. The Marines don’t have that problem.â€
Reagan….
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor.
–Truman Capote
Replies
That's gotta be just some litigation-speak.
Sand IS silicon dioxide (oxidixed silica).
Weird.
Forrest - why can't kids just play with "Big Ol' Bag O' Glass", or "Big Ol' Bag O' Nails" like the old SNL sketch.
Found the learned reference -
Toy maker Irwin Mainway (Dan Aykroyd) would appear on this talk show and hopelessly defend his company's extremely dangerous products such as "Bag O' Glass", "Bag O' Vipers", "Bag O' Sulfuric Acid", "Mr. Skin Grafter", "Pretty Peggy's Ear Piercing Kit", "Doggy Dentist", "Chancellor Tron's Secret Police Confession Kit", "Johnny Switchblade Adventure Punk", and "Chainsaw Teddybear".
A sketch frequently aired by SNL on their Halloween retrospective special had Mainway defending Halloween costumes such as a military outfit that included an actual working rifle ("very popular in Detroit!"), an entirely black and non-reflective uniform called "Invisible Pedestrian" (which had a warning on the package that read "NOT FOR BLIND KIDS"), an airtight plastic bag that was to be affixed over the head with a rubber band called "Johnny Space Commander Mask," and an oil-soaked costume called "Johnny Human Torch", which came complete with an oversized lighter.
Each sketch would end with the host (Jane Curtin) condemning Mainway's products, while Mainway would make pathetic attempts to show how more commonplace toys/clothing were equally harmful.
Forrest
I thought it said Crystalline Silica. Is this the same thing?
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
I believe so - maybe some chemists here? That guy that commented about paint strippers recently is one.
Forrest
Yes, that sand is dangerous. I saw the MSDS for bottled compressed air. It said you were supposed to use it in a well ventilated space. I'm not kidding.
I saw the MSDS for bottled compressed air. It said you were supposed to use it in a well ventilated space. I'm not kidding.
They can go over board sometimes. In the compressed air thing, they may be thinking the components may or may not be proportioned correctly all the time in every bottle. Make sense? Something could have happened and maybe more Nitrogen instead of "air" or oxygen. Maybe even some carbon dioxide got mixed in.
which would be the reason for a ventilated space. I would worry if it were a air bottle for scuba diving!
Knew three people that got killed in an rail car that "everyone" thought had air in it. But instead the system was backed by nitrogen. The process air system went down and the nitrogen kicked in to supply the needed "air" to keep the product moving. The guys had a problem and went inside the car to retrieve something. One after another they went in. The second two were trying to rescue the first guy.
A fourth guy tried too to get in but was too big. A body builder type.
One or two breaths of nitrogen and you are through.
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
H2O also has a listing in MSDS library! People die from exposure to it every year and thousands will die in the future too, they just don't read the label when it's in plain sight.
Yep, I'm not going outside anymore without my safety glasses, dust mask,sunscreen, ear plugs, condom.....
maybe some chemists here?
Not a chemist, but a geologist. Sand is predominately to completely quartz. Quartz is a mineral, which chemically is crystalline silica dioxide. Some sand can be composed of small grains of other rocks like basalt ("black sand"), and coral. But volumetrically, these are geologically minor
Edited 4/16/2008 8:31 pm ET by McMark
McMark,
As a geologist, you know that Basaltic magmas contain around 50% silica.
A long time ago, I put away a rock hammer for a framing hammer.
Faulted
You are confusing silica, silicone, and silicates. Silicone is the element Si, and is the most abundant positively charged element in the earths crust.
Silica is the chemical name for SiO^2. In basaltic rocks, there is no free quartz. Some analysis of chemical abundance show the elements as oxides, FeO, MgO, SiO^2, etc. But these elements crystallize into silicates. In a basalt, all the silicone is in silicate minerals, such as pyroxene (enstatite) MgSiO^3.
Granite has an abundance of Si, and after the other elements such as Ca, Na, Fe, are tied up in feldspars and micas (for example), there is enough Si to crystallize as free quartz.
WOW!!!
I am glad I am a layman........ :-)
You are definitely into the rock! LOL
That be mineral not Hudson..........
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
THis is a much better, safer, funner toy for kids than that deadly silica sand...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPHtKarae2Q"Research is what I'm doing when I don't know what I'm doing..."
been a while since I read the directions on a bag of sand... ;-) As Forest said, I think most sand contains silica though. BTW - isn't "playsand" washed? Wouldn't that remove most of the dust?
When I was a kid I had the most "awesomest" sandbox in the neighborhood. Must be one reason why I grew up loving to create things with my hands...
Get rid of the sand box. Buy him some law books. Sign him up for a subscription to some medical journals. Get him an X-box 360 elite - even if he is only 2yo. It's the new millennium man - get with the program. Don't let your babies grow up to be cowboys. :-)
Don't let your babies grow up to be cowboys. :-)
If I have anything to do with it he'll be all boy! LOL
Dirt, sand and all........
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
OK then... don't buy him a Ken doll. Even GI joe could be risky...
Do they even have GI Joes?
I had the whole gambit. Jeeps, half track looking vehicles, bald ones, fuzzy headed ones, etc.....
Probably worth a mint now!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
"
Get rid of the sand box. Buy him some law books. Sign him up for a subscription to some medical journals. Get him an X-box 360 elite - even if he is only 2yo. It's the new millennium man - get with the program. Don't let your babies grow up to be cowboys. :-)"
Thats funny right there .
it most likely depends on the type of rocks or material or that determine how much silica is in the sand
like black sand is mostly volcanic and white sand may be limestone
beach sand around here is quartz.. which is mostly silica, and explains why the big dunes in Indiana were destroyed so that mason jars could be made by Ball Glass years ago
so don't come up here trying to steal any
BTW I'm still experimenting with your gift ! :)
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all sand has silica, cement too
cement too
I read that also. Didn't know it though.
Thinking of the dust I have inhaled cutting concrete, etc.....Not much but none the less inhaled.
You see brickers with out dust masks, respirators, concrete cutters without them, etc.... Not good at all.
I remember speaking to someone sanding on a floor one day dust everywhere, I mean every crevice had dust, that fine stuff all over in the air. He made the comment he was glad saw dust doesn't cause lung cancer........This was in between cigarettes!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
I guess DS will be ok. Just reading that on the bags made me take a step backwards. I put it in the terms of the beach. Everyone goes to the beach, albeit most of it is damp sand. I think he will be ok with what I purchased. Unless someone comes forward with skull and cross bones for what I purchased.
Not likely he is going to snort the stuff with a straw.
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
what kind of heavy equipment you gonna get him to with that sand....
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
He's the excavator, track hoe type of guy.
LOL, loves watching them on extreme homes tear apart the house. Then DW spoils the show and makes him go to bed! At least he sees the distruction!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
I had dirt and water to play in.
Mama didnt want me back in the house.
Drywall mud and texture is much worse than sand . Paint is worse than that . Laquer is worse than that .
Sand somehow seems harmless.
Tim
even sand made from coral ?.
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BTW I'm still experimenting with your gift ! :)
Great! Hope it works out! LOL
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
is this something we can watch the horizon for the "experiments" results????
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
That would turn into glass from the horizon!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
several layered #12 welders plates are in order then....
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
#12 welders plates are in order then.... ??
What is a #12 welder plate and what would he do with them? LOL
Probably take that ford you have to move them!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
yep, I tried it in the cold frame to give our garden seeds a head start and after a couple hours I had steam & the outside temp was in the 40s ....
maybe I'll lay down in there
like a hillbilly sauna I also threw it in a bird bath that had some ice still in it and it managed to dry all the water out in one day too hoo boy that stuff is hot !.
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Actually sand boxes can be hazardous to ur health .When i was a lil kid my brother and I both got ringworm and had to get our heads shaved.Apparently it comes from cats using the sand box as thier litter box. and dont forget it doesnt have to be ur cat..just a visitor.
We have a cover over ours.
Do have to worry about critters in the sand!
I was weak and too lazy! I bought one of those back Hoe sand boxes by wally world. Sorry.........
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
icky !!! cat pootie.
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I bet the birds loved ya for that!
At least for a little while........ :-)
Slow cook'em in the bath then eat a hot lunch later on!
I never thought about heating the seedlings! Great idea!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
Yep, most varieties of sand contain silica.
Wikipedia is your friend here... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sand
"The most common constituent of sand, in inland continental settings and non-tropical coastal settings, is silica (silicon dioxide, or SiO2), usually in the form of quartz, which, because of its chemical inertness and considerable hardness, is resistant to weathering.
The composition of sand is highly variable, depending on the local rock sources and conditions. The bright white sands found in tropical and subtropical coastal settings are eroded limestone and may contain coral and shell fragments in addition to other organic or organically derived fragmental material."
From the Hazards section...
"While sand is generally harmless, one must take care with some activities involving sand such as sandblasting. Bags of silica sand used for sandblasting now carry labels warning the user to wear respiratory protection and avoid breathing the fine silica dust. There have been a number of lawsuits in recent years where workers have developed silicosis, a lung disease caused by inhalation of fine silica particles over long periods of time. Material safety data sheets (MSDS) for silica sand state that "excessive inhalation of crystalline silica is a serious health concern".[1]
In areas of high pore water pressure sand can partially liquefy to form quicksand. Quicksand, once dried, produces a considerable barrier to escape for creatures caught within, who often die from exposure as a result."
Sounds like as long as he's not focused on a career in the sandbox, he'll be fine.
Sounds like as long as he's not focused on a career in the sandbox, he'll be fine.
Sweet! Thanks! He'll be happy not to see me dump it out somewhere.... :-)
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
Yep, sand is some dangerous stuff. ;-)
If you get a chance, read a book by Phillip Howard "The Death of Common Sense"
He tells how a brick company that has been operating for decades is fined thousands of dollars by OSHA for improperly labeling and storing sand...... along with other bureaucratic nightmares--- a pretty good read.
Back when I was a planner I read that the government was considering posting warnings on sand traps ("bunkers") at golf courses! Conceivably you can get silicosis. I would be concerned if I sand blasted without a mask, or if I lived somewhere there were lots of sand storms.
Anybody that's ever seen me trying to blast my way out of a sand trap, would agree that a government warning is merited. ;-)
I lived somewhere there were lots of sand storms.
Makes me wonder about being in the middle east........
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
If you get a chance, read a book by Phillip Howard "The Death of Common Sense
I'll check it out!
Eat any bugs lately? I'm start'in to get the taste fer em'
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
Eat any bugs lately?
We boiled up a couple sacks a week ago and we got a big boil planned for this Saturday.
Somebody boiled up some deer tamales in the crab boil.... good stuff.
Of coarse the kids need to have crawfish fights and races.
I've got a CCA Banquet to go to tonight.... they either serve crawfish or Outback caters steak... I'll find out in an hour.
Deer Tamales?
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
At least wear eye protection.
Beer was created so carpenters wouldn't rule the world.
I agree! But short of sun glasses it is a no go for him!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
Not a chemist, nor geologist; but if I remember the health warnings rightly (as opposed to the court case decisions) the risk of 'silica' is when you have 6+ hours or daily work exposure to micron and under particulates from grinding, cutting, milling and the like; and also smoke.
But, the cruel irony of silicosis it that it seems to occur whenever you expose your lungs to crystalline particulates under 0.5micron over a regular basis, so the material may not matter. Which is made worse by the physiological aspects of smoking (back when a person could do that in the workplace).
The worst part is that if you start from a premise of "0 exposure = 0 risk" you may need filtering down to 0.1micron or less to be "lawsuit proof."
Heard that CA is debating requiring charcoal be labeled as "Damaging to the Environment" and to give equivalent CO2 remediation levels on all the bags (since they are bound and determined to label all things containing benzine rings as carcinogenic).
You know the general public doesn't give a rats behind about particulates in microns or ppm's as most are not exposed to those terms.
Which is one reason the guvment may go overboard with hazard warnings.
There is also a sense of false safety. If I can go to a store and by salt, charcoal and sand it has to be safe. Doesn't it? The government is looking after us the consumer right? LOL
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
"In the compressed air thing, they may be thinking the components may or may not be proportioned correctly all the time in every bottle. Make sense? Something could have happened and maybe more Nitrogen instead of "air" or oxygen. Maybe even some carbon dioxide got mixed in."
No, you have to make sure that you have ventilation so you don't blow the windows out ;o)
Jeff
No, you have to make sure that you have ventilation so you don't blow the windows out ;o)
LOL!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
Sometimes the warnings are little alarmist - thank the lawyers. For instance, consider these first aid tips from the MSDS for NaCl (sodium chloride, that's table salt):
Eyes: Flush eyes with plenty of water for at least 15 minutes, occasionally lifting the upper and lower eyelids. Get medical aid.
Skin: Flush skin with plenty of soap and water for at least 15 minutes while removing contaminated clothing and shoes. Get medical aid if irritation develops or persists. Wash clothing before reuse.
Ingestion: If victim is conscious and alert, give 2-4 cupfuls of milk or water. Get medical aid. Wash mouth out with water.
Inhalation: Remove from exposure to fresh air immediately. If not breathing, give artificial respiration. If breathing is difficult, give oxygen. Get medical aid if cough or other symptoms appear.
I especially like the first aid for ingestion! Good thing that I had beer with my tacos tonight...
LOL! That is crazy! I put salt in my beer! No wonder I am safe.
I wonder how much salt they are speaking about? A pound? LOL
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
Inhalation: Remove from exposure to fresh air immediately.
Woo, uh, wait, if you are inhaling salt, aren't you like in a mine collapse or the like? "Remove to fresh air. Call US Bureau of Mines", something like that? <g>
Wait, how do we get the patient below 11% "contaminated" with NaCl?Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
You have misunderstood."Inhalation: Remove from exposure to fresh air immediately. If not breathing, give artificial respiration. If breathing is difficult, give oxygen. Get medical aid if cough or other symptoms appear. "It says to remove FROM exposure to fresh air. Apparently that fresh air stuff, is more lethal than breathing salt.
Politics: the blind insulting the blind.
Click here for access to the Woodshed Tavern
Edited 4/17/2008 9:12 pm by Luka
And the grammar police sez "remove FROM exposure TO fresh air, ain't yah ever diagrammed a sentence before?
Exactly.Fresh air is what yer supposed to remove the person FROM exposure TO.Duh !!
Politics: the blind insulting the blind.
Click here for access to the Woodshed Tavern
Hey its gummit rules yer probably suppsoed to look it up in the manual and then use you're common sense.
I just count us all lucky that there IS no fresh air.Whew! could you imagine the planetwide hospital costs ???
Politics: the blind insulting the blind.
Click here for access to the Woodshed Tavern
Everyone seems to be taking anti-oxidants nowadays--well, if you just keep away from air with all that oxygen, you are all set; don't even need anti-oxidants!
Apparently that fresh air stuff, is more lethal than breathing salt
Well, the evidence is pretty conclusive--everyone born breathing air eventually dies, so it can't be good for you.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
May not be completely benign. There is a web section on silicosis, etc. at the OSHA web site. I haven't been through it, but would guess that the real hazard is in mining & manufacturing where there is a dusty environment.
http://www.osha.gov/SLTC/silicacrystalline/index.html
Dusty is the key........
Moist is better!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
install several shower heads in his sand box for when he uses it...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
install several shower heads in his sand box for when he uses it...
He needs them for when he is done!
What is it about wimmens and younuns getting dirty?
She wants him outside to play but cringes when he gets dirty! Can't have it both ways! Boys will be boys..........
Thats when I step in with my diplomatic charisma and save him from the tiger! LOL
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
set it up so that he becomes dredging king of the neighborhood.....
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
He would no doubt be dredging in water and the sand!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
he could put shipping channels thru his sand box....
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
he could put shipping channels thru his sand box....
Oh, we have left the cover off before and it does hold water!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
put the shower heads in...
send him out there to play in his swim trunks or even his birthday suit...
when play time is over amp up the water flow and then he can shower off the sand and it can stay in the box and not get drug into the house...
and ya get a semi sorta cleaned up kid in progress....
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
Great idea! Stay cool during the summer also!
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
there's a thread around here on copper pipe sizes some place....
should help with what size line ya need...
my vote is for a 2" supply line...
give him is own personal deluge....
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
turning him into a swabbie?
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
it's either that or the Marines...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming<!----><!----><!---->
WOW!!! What a Ride!Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!