I have an upcoming job of making/installing raised or flat panel wainscotting in a room approx. 18′ x 22′, with a few doors cutting up the walls.This will be poplar with cherry stain & the walls are framed with metal studs(if this matters)
As a cabinet maker, my first thought would be to fab./finish the panels (cope & stick) in the shop as we would do for the backside of an island or peninsula. We have done this on lengths of 10′-12′ with no problem.
However, after thumbing through the sept. issue of FHB, I came across an article on installing wainscotting. The author site built a paint grade panel system very similar to what I will be doing.
My question is, Do you see any advantage of one method over another,I can reduce time on the site with shop building the panels, which keeps me out of the way of the other trades and vise-versa
Any ideas/thoughts would be greatly appreciated
Replies
If you have the opportunity to do some in the shop I would opt to.
I have done it both ways and for my money anything I can do in the shop just makes it that much easier in the field.
That's not to say that you cant get just as good of results by site building the whole thing.
One other thing, if you do do it in the shop just as you would cabinets, make sure you got very good measurements, for everything!
Doug
Edited 11/2/2004 6:19 pm ET by Doug@es
yep, story poles.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations.
Man, on a site, or in a shop, with my tools, my radio, my coffee, . . . shop. Story pole . . hmmmm good idea. I'd lay it out, plan on what goes in first and what follows in what order, and plan your end of the wall pieces with intentional scribe room on them.
With metal studs, you'd be a lot happier with wood blocking. However, since you're putting solid panels on everything, you do have that option. You could cut access holes where you need the blocking (staying under your finished height), slip the wood in, put the cutout back in with frogs, bam.
"If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain
Building it in the shop does sound like the way to go. As for the blocking, unless I want to put it in on my own dime, it wont be there. i had thought I would screw high & low into the metal studs where it would be covered by the base and char rail & let the middle float????
Well, it's a valid point, but my reservation is thus: in any other trim scenario, would you allow 4 ft of anything to go unsupported? Probably not. But I really like the idea of keeping the trim screws out of view. So perhaps - and you gotta answer this; I don't know the design or layout - perhaps you do like you said, and then the vertical members, which have an interlocking (glued) joint top and bottom, are also reinforced behind with structural adhesive, i.e. PL400 or similar. Then the panel still floats, and you've supported on 4 sides, creating a situation no different than a cabinet door."If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain
I would agree the shop might be the best way to go, but the condition of the walls might also dictate the finished product. Wavy walls with no blocking may be much easier to get a better job when constructed in place, piece by piece. You could still mass produce parts in the shop and do a site install.
ADH Carpentry & Woodwork
Quality, Craftsmanship, Detail
Wavy walls with no blocking are a big concern to me on this job, this would be my main reason for thinking of building them in the shop.
I would think that a solidly built raised panel assembly would go up easier & span wall imperfections better than trying to attach many smaller individual pcs. to just drywall, but maybe I'm missing something??
You're right. I should have explained myself a little better. I guess I was mostly thinking of installing the final pieces later: top & bottom rails, etc.
I'm mostly a job site kinda guy, I envisioned some method you trying to fit a whole completed unit to a bad wall. Sounds to me you're thinkin' what I'm thinkin'.ADH Carpentry & Woodwork
Quality, Craftsmanship, Detail
Actually I WAS thinking of installing the completed wainscot on possibly bad walls in premade/prefinished sections
Basically, I think my only concern was fitting the whole completed unit against a bad wall where there might be gaps. I have a kitchen countertop in mind. You know, belt sanding, planing, etc. Are there any measures to take to try to get the panels to fit better against the wall? Maybe build it with a 1/4 inch reveal on the back of the top cap for fitting purposes?
Have you checked the walls yet? Maybe we are ahead of ourselves!
Another thing that comes to mind is using drywall furring strips in some places to straighten the panels if the walls are bad.ADH Carpentry & Woodwork
Quality, Craftsmanship, Detail
The walls were just framed, I plan on stopping by in the next day or two to check them out & beg for blocking.
I'm hoping that with metal studs maybe things will be pretty even, isnt that their claim to fame??
Ya know, you are 100% right about the metal studs and wavy walls. They aren't supposed to happen! I hadn't thought of it until it was just mentioned.
How about a pic or two when it's done? ADH Carpentry & Woodwork
Quality, Craftsmanship, Detail
Wavy walls ???? How ? By useing warped DW? crooked screws?
I agree that the shop is the way to go but how about machine all parts where the tools are and move picies to site for assembly and fitting.
check with DW supply houses and ask them about these 8 " wide pieces of 3/4 ply with groves on the ends for steel studs and do your blocking in Peace.
If I had a buck for every time I have opened a wall behind an upper cabinet to place blocking just to cover my access hole with the cabinet I would have like 6 bucks or something. J/K. Sounds like a nice project. Mike
Even if the walls are wavy you don't want your panels to have that same look, do you!
You can block out or shim to take care of the wavy wall, you sure as hell don't want to telegraph that look through to your paneled wall.
Your top cap will take care of hiding any voids behind the wall.
I would laser it, storypole it, produce myself a set of shop fab drawings, design in scribe or loose-fit parts wherever necessary, and go to work at home. Site installation can be as little as a couple hours, truck key to truck key.
Don't overlook the benefits of good dust collection and greater ease of cleanup in the shop, either.
You can also largely prefinish a wainscot and chair rail job in the shop, as well. Not so easy on site.
I recently did two ajoining rooms, each approx 16'x16'. The first I preassembled the long runs like you said with a rail butt joint near the middle of each wall splitting a stile.
The second room I fastened the bottom rail to the wall then added stiles, panel and top rail. Also I only made the panels after the stiles were in place. that gave me a lot of room for fudge
The second room went much quicker. Logistically it sounds easier to do it the first way but it is not. It takes two people to handle the long runs where one person can assemble in place.
I also had to move almost every wall outlet. It is so much easier when all I had to do was smash the old box and surrounding drywall and cut an old work box into the panel