My wife has expressed a desire to replace our gas cooktop with a full-on range. She’s pretty good about putting up with me, and this would be a good way to make her think there is a benefit to keeping me around, so I’d like to do this. Should be easy, right?
Right now we have a cooktop that drops into a cutout in the formica countertop. This sits over a 30″ base cabinet. Just pull out the 30″ cabinet and roll in a 30″ range. My question is: how do I remove just the section of countertop that sits over the cabinet I want to remove without making a complete mess of everything? We plan to replace the formica countertop with something else, but that project is down the road a bit.
I can see running the 7-1/4″ circular saw right across the formica (or maybe a router, get a cleaner cut without the upcut from a saw blade) but in either case I’m going to hit the base of the tool against the wall at the back of the countertop. How do I cleanly finish the last 3″ or so of the cut right up to the wall? The wall at the back of the countertop is tiled from the counter surface up to the upper cabinets to create a backsplash. Any hints on separating the formica from the bottom row of tiles without making a mess would also be welcome.
Thanks much for your assistance
Replies
I'd think a handsaw would be the simplest way to finish the cut. Do you have a RotoZip or similar? As far as separating the counter from the tile is the seam caulked? If so you oughta just be able to cut through it with a utility knife.
Oops...I see you aren't demoing the countertop...doh... the below post about masking tape, etc is good advice since you're trying to preserve the countertop, although minor chipping could be covered by edge trim.
Edited 10/13/2004 2:18 pm ET by PaulB
I'm sure the pros will have a better answer than this, but a jig saw with a decent blade might handle the last 3" OK. I'm not sure if I'm picturing your problem correctly though.
Hubert
You might consider using a short handsaw. Lowe's or HD sell a Shark Tooth Handsaw for around $25 bucks or so. They may sell a carbide Formica knife for a couple of bucks also.
Go ahead and score the line you going to skill saw with the carbide cutter. Then finis the cut with the handsaw primarily cutting with pressure on the down stroke. Pull away on the upstroke, this so you don't chip the surface.
I would apply some masking tape at the line and a few inches away to support the skillsaws shoe so it doesn't scratch the surface. Use a 24 tooth or more thin kerf blade tho.
There are other ways but this might be the cheapest for you.
Good luck!
Edited 10/13/2004 2:14 pm ET by JAGWAH
Bosch makes a down cut jiigsaw blade..if your saw is a bosch shank style. Finish with a handsaw.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations.
Jigsaw blades will tend to wander, less so the wider the blade. I'd instead use a Roto-Zip following a straightedge on the countertop and backsplash. In the best of worlds, taking out the countertop before cutting would be the way to go.
end yur wandering...
Try the Bosch...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
right on..mine cuts like a laser.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations.
The Bosch jigsaw blade has a part number like 123BR (but it's not 123). They also sell 123B blades ... the difference is the R which means the teeth are reversed and cut down. You need to press down on the saw, forcing it against the countertop, cuz as the teeth are cutting on the downstroke, they try to push the saw up. It's not a big problem, but it might catcvh you off guard.
Whenever you are asked if you can do a job, tell'em "Certainly, I can!" Then get busy and find out how to do it. T. Roosevelt
Ed, I hate this blades. But I use them many-many times and they work good.
In theory.
YCF Dino
Well I have cut many a counter with a down cutting blade in a jigsaw ... I would never consider touching one with a roto-zip. In fact I have not found any job that those tools can do decently well.
A Roto-Zip with a carbide bit works well cutting laminate; they also excel at cutting knockouts in sheetrock. As Jeff pointed out, a router with a 1/2" shank and straight cutter would also work well here.
But hey, why not buy a new tool?
When you'all say 'formica' I assume you mean laminant? Nice to see I'm not the only person not using stone.
With laminant, if you make a fairly straight cut, you can buy end pieces which will glue to the newly cut edges (giving them a more finished look). That assumes you can find your pattern.
And to repeat those replying before me: Taping the cut is good advise. Good jigsaw will do the trick, even if you have to use a guide to make it straight.
Many thanks for all the suggestions. I've never actually tried to cut laminate bonded to MDF with a hand saw, didn't know if it could be successfully done. I don't own a Roto-zip, but any opportunity for a new tool sounds good. I do have a Bosch jigsaw, so I'll look for some of those blades.
thanks again,
-hubert
I thought by your post you were just a simple homeowner. But since you stated
I don't own a Roto-zip, but any opportunity for a new tool sounds good.
Let me be more supportive... You need a new Roto-Zip it's a most exccellent tool and would be useful here. You should practice a little before using.
Since you say you have a Bosch jig saw, my tool of choice, I would really plan on using it instead. Since you share a common affliction to most Breaktimers I know you can use the right words so the DW will understand.
Great excuse I heard here but have been saving for the big one," But Honey it followed me home, what was I to do, ain't it cute."
Yes, you are correct, I am but a simple HO. But I do get a thrill out of tackling diy projects regardless of whether or not I know what I'm doing. Actually, the less I know, the more thrilling things get. But to date I have not yet burned down the house or electrocuted the mailman, and still have all my fingers. I hope to keep the trend going.
In fact my wife is very good about me bring home new tools, just as long as I can maintain the perception that there is some small chance that I might do something useful with them. Never know, stranger things have happened. But just to show how well I really did marry, for my 40th birthday she gave me a 5 hp 10" Powermatic table saw. I think I'll keep her.
Another way is to remove your countertop.
(There is only few screws on the bottom.) and cut the counter with the formica at the bottom. ( with a circular saw and any carbide blade $12-15.00 )
YCF Dino
Hi you may have already solved your prop but. Lots of good info already Here is my 2 cents. I would use a sharp carbide blade on a skillsaw with a straight edge or if you have one the festool saw and saw guide. I would finish the cut with a sharp hand saw. the othe gentlemen who mentioned Scoreing and tape were dead on
good luck
Hi Buck.
The circular saw with a good blade and cut with the mica face down is the best way.And yes,using the Festool or another guide or straight edge with your saw is even better. scoring and tape is ok but you have to cut at list 1/16" away from the line and use a belt sander with the cord side down so you don't lift and brake the mica.
The best way is to remove the counter top and just use your circular saw.
And I think you reply to the wrong poster.
See You
YCF Dino
Edited 10/13/2004 11:54 pm ET by YCFriend
Another way is to remove your countertop. (There is only few screws on the bottom.)
Maybe and maybe not. If I put the counter in, then its being held by screws. BUT, I've encountered staples/adhesive (or nail/adhesive) combinations that were a bit messy to pull up.
It sounds like he is either mortar'ed or caulked to the wall, in which case it would be a lot messier to pull the counter up and he'd probably wanna cut it in place. The circ saw can make a nice straight cut, but he probably wouldn't wanna stand on his head to make it.jt8
Just don't give any more ideas. You never know.
That's why I say ANOTHER Way.
The true is that you have to see it in order to come up with the best solution.
And always before you start any job you should think for few minutes. You may save hours or days by looking at different options.
The circ saw can make a nice straight cut, but he probably wouldn't wanna stand on his head to make it.
Let me think about this for few days.
YCF Dino
Oh wait, I forgot... whatever advise we would give, we would be spending someone else's money. In that case, rip it all out and put in granite and some big, gaudy ss appliances. ;)
And you sure you wanna keep those cabinets? If you're gonna 'invest' in granite countertops, you might as well upgrade those cabinets... and geeze, doesn't that make the DR look kinda shabby... Guess we'd better put in some new hw floors in there and maybe some oak trim... And might as well tear out part of that wall between the DR and LR.. open up the plan a bit to really showcase the updates.
And if you don't want that new DR hw floor butting up against that old LR carpet... guess we'd better pull that out and put new in... and probably better add new baseboard all the way around... and while you're messing with that wall, you've always wanted to add another couple outlets... And wouldn't it be handy if we could just bump that wall out a couple feet, and man, wouldn't that entryway look good with ceramic tile?
Sorry.... I was having a This Old House moment. :)
jt8
You are evil.
Must not let wife see post. Must burn computer.
a router and a straight edge will give you by far the best cut on the laminate ...
a circular saw is great if you can lay on your back and cut from the bottom ... which pretty much sounds impossible.
and a rotozip is gonna be one big headache.
don't get me wrong ... I love my rotozip ... but the commercials lie!
and a sharp fine tooth handsaw is the best way to finish the cut ...
or ... a fine tooth blade in a sawzaw.
for the remaining cut ... I'd score like hell thru the laminate and tape it off too.
Now if it was my CT ...
I'd do it the right way and take it outside for the cutting ...
lay it upside down ... simply cut the whole damn thing from the backside with the circular saw.
That's what I'd do for any customer that requested this too.
don't forget to glue on the new egde laminate.
Jeff
Thanks again to everyone for the tips. I'm leaning towards the router approach, and then finish up to the tile with a handsaw. I could use one of those laminate trimmers that holds 1/4" bits (new tool!) and get a lot closer than I could with my standard PC router base. I've got some laminate scraps lying around, I think I'll make up some practice pieces to try out my backwards sawing technique.
Removing the countertop was something that didn't even occur to me, but I don't think it's an option, or at least not an easy one. It's L-shaped with the sink in the corner, it was built in place. There is a seam in the laminate that runs through the sink cutout, which of course doesn't match where the mdf is joined. Removing the sink and pulling that whole monster out does not seem appetizing, but I remain open to suggestion.
Look into the Bosch 1608/9 series.....
http://www.boschtools.com
It's the cat's meow kind of thing...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
I was gonna give some smart a$$ remark about remembering to not drive the drywall screws in too far when ya screw down the straight edge ...
till I remembered you could actually do this ... on the inside/waste area.
Jeff
Funny you should ask this question since it reminds me of a job I did a few years back. I subbed some trim for this contractor who turned out to be a hack and a pain. On one job he framed the door ROs at the door size, then he complained that he would have to pay extra. He got into a bind remodeling a store and couldn't get his money until one last thing was done. There were existing sales counters but the new cash registers would not fit. The counters were all laminate with shelves and partitions. The kind of places most tools won't fit. He wanted to know if I knew how to make the necessary alterations. He went on and on about how he knew it would be expensive and nobody could figure out how to do it. Eventually he mentioned $400. I figured he had told the owner $600 so I told him $550. Everybody agreed so I went out to the truck and grabbed my trusty 10pt. I had those openings fixed in about 2 hrs. I was even able to peel a layer of formica off a cut section to use for edge banding. Easiest $550 I made in a while but the best part was telling the old coot that it's expensive paying for knowledge.
I'm quite good with a hand saw and you will have to be too. You will probably have to climb up on the counter and contort yourself just to get in a good position. Make nice, straight, slow, downward cuts with a sharp cross cut saw. If you are good with a saw you can cut backward, teeth away from you. the very last inch will be the hardest and you may have to finish with a chisel after cutting the laminate with a razor knife.
Power tools won't get into the corner, circular saw would be a disaster from the top. Pulling off the counter is best but it may pull off the tiles too. If worse comes to worst they sell some plastic/rubber pieces for closing the gap between range and countertop. Might have seen them in a Walter Drake catalog.
Beat it to fit / Paint it to match
Don't forget to do something to seal the edges after you get the cuts made ... the chipboard edges are prone to easy damage from any liquids.
I'm suprised nobody as listed the Fein multimaster
perfect tool for this job
Absolutely right, guys - the Fein MultiMaster is great for this, especially when you get to the backsplash, whether it's post-formed or flat. This is a nifty tool, somewhat pricey, but ask around. One of your buds might let you borrow his. But be careful, it's easy to get the blade too hot, and they're EXPENSIVE !
Greg
Edited 10/14/2004 12:53 pm ET by Greg Gibson