Can you fellas give me some examples of when a sliding compound miter saw would be beneficial? So far I’ve used my regular CMS for trim etc. I have a 10″ CMS that wasn’t able to cut 5 1/2″ base.
I’m definitely looking at 12″ now but wondering if I should invest in a slider or just a regular saw.
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Replies
I don't know what a 12" non slider costs, but you can get a nice 10" slider for under 500 skins. Well worth the investment in my mind. It's like the difference between the original power miter saws and compound miter saws - each was great when it was the latest evolution of the tool, but they are both dated.
Now that tool has evolved to sliding miter saws that can be tilted to either side, and they've been around long enough that they have the bugs worked out of them. Just bite the bullet and invest in the most versatile tool you can afford. I don't think you'll regret it.
TIPI,TIPI,TIPI!
I like my Bosch 10" slider. Works great for everything I've thrown at it - but I do remodels, a little bit of everything, but no one thing extensively. A little large, heavy and cumbersome for one-man set-up, but great tool once its set up.
"he...never charged nothing for his preaching, and it was worth it, too" - Mark Twain
Just bought one and haven't used it yet. The new 12" Dewalt 718 slider is one hell of a tool. I have the 705cms which is now a decade or so old but still going strong and I have no intentions of shelving it. Sliders are great for doing wider stock, and this particular tool has more versatility than ever. I recommend you go to the Dewalt website and check out the 12" slider, they show a video on it. I have used Bosch and Makita and they are both good tools. I'm just used to the Dewalt...I like the D handle grip among other things, plus the DW repair and replace service ctr is right around the corner from me and they do a good job.
I got 10% off through a friend plus a $50 rebate, so I saved about $110 off their price of $650. Not bad.
If you're doing and serious work, get a slider and go for the 12". HD has a $50 rebate going on right now with the DW718.
I'll second the upcheck for the Dewalt 718.
I've lived with a very early (20 + years) B&D 10" chop saw for eons. The only feature it has is a detent at 45 degrees. Built one house and did minor remodel in three others with this critter. Noisy as a bad cat and no brake or soft start. Won't cut a 2X6 at 45 degrees.
Finally bit the bullet and got the Dewalt 718 last week. At age 62, I wanted a solid, reputable brand, and a saw that didn't weigh a ton. Sayonara to the new Hitachi that otherwise might have filled the bill.
I also own the new Dewalt hybrid table saw. When I had a minor problem with the trick miter gage that came with the sliding table, I found customer service to be excellent. In fact, I got a human being on the first call ! That swayed me to the 718.
Chris
Edited 2/7/2006 10:13 pm ET by ChrisB
Not really an answer to your question but, I have a 12" slider and I think its great. If the budget allowed though, I would also get a non slider. There has been more than one occasion when i've hauled my big slider to a small job for literally one or two cuts.
Bottom line I would still go with the slider. Much more versatile.
Always have a non slider on hand. I have a 10" and a 12" non. A bit excessive some may say but when the shoe fits...
Ya might say I said the same thing.
Tim
Bigger isn't always better. I have the 8" dewalt. It will cut a 12" board at 90*, and is very light and portable. Made in italy. It will not cut a 2x4 standing up ... misses by about 1/4",
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
You might want to research this one:
List Price:
$1,085.00Our Price: $488.00
You Save: $597.00 (55%)
http://www.heavydutytools.net/Scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=89
"You might want to research this one:
List Price:
$1,085.00Our Price: $488.00 You Save: $597.00 (55%) http://www.heavydutytools.net/Scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=89"Tools guy:
You might check with Mark at HDT, I think he may have a couple of non-laser 1013's left that he might make you a deal on. I saw some in the back when I was picking up some plumbing a few weeks ago.
Bob
Yeah I've seen that one but at that point why would I want a 10" slider vs. a 12"? Bit cheaper yes but doesnt it defeat the purpose of having the height advantage of a 12"?
A double bevel slider gives you more choice in where the saw exits the trim improving the finished product. A 12" will cut larger stock but that 12" is more prone to blade wobble. A small twang in a piece can torque the blade enough to frustate any half or quarter degree adjustments in that 8" crown afterwards. Assess what you're cutting and what the finished results need to be. The larger the blade the more prone to deflection and wobble. Whatever the size get plenty of blades and keep them sharp, change as soon as you think you should because you probably already should have, already, have, should...
Oh man this is getting more interesting by the minute. Thought this would be straight forward. Thanks for the info though. I would have never thought of that.
So now the question arises. Dewalt, Makita or Bosch. I've seen some so so reviews on the Bosch. I like the Makita but I prefer the D handle. Anyone have any preferences?
Don't forget to look at Hitachi
Bass,
Have you seen the new(ish) Hitachi C12LSH SCMS? If so do you like it? It slides on fixed rails so it has better clearance in the rear for stationary use. I need a saw I can mount on a bench and allow room for dust collection behind it. Thanks.
I would like to get that Hitachi C12LSH for the shop. I've been using and abusing the Hitachi C10FS for about 10 years. I'm sure I would kill the litte E.T. looking electronic readout by loading stuff in and out of the van. The C12LSH also weighs about 66 pounds (22lbs heavier than my C10FS).I've looked at Bosch, Dewalt and Makita...all good...I just like my Hitachi slider better. It still cuts large crown molding miters dead on. The accuracy of the saw has never required even the slightest adjustment. In 10 years I have had to replace the cord (broke a prong off by tripping over the cord--"Grace is my middle name"), and replaced the belt once. My old Hitachi fence is pitifully small, but doesn't get in the way. When I need a taller fence, it takes me only a minute to add one (I keep add-on fences and jigs for specialty work handy.
Love my Bosch! Hitachi was gonna be my #2 choice, then Makita was my #3. But I got a good deal on the Bosch, and went for it. Funny thing, I paid extra for the laser model, and have never mounted the laser! - go figure!"he...never charged nothing for his preaching, and it was worth it, too" - Mark Twain
I like how easy the Bosch is to read--very clear and convenient settings.Like how light, durable and accurate the Hitachi is.
Does the Bosch allow you to make fractional miter adjustments without the detents? I think the Dewalt does. What I mean is you can make very small adjustments away from square.
The Dewalt 718 has a detent over ride so you can have any angle you want close up to any detent. I use a Forrest blade in mine and there is absolutely no runout. So far so good. I'm tempted to get a laser for it but.....ahhh probly wouldn't use it half the time.
The 718 will cut 12" boards,why would you buy anything else?
I think that there is a trade off, to some degree, between how secure the positive stops are--and how easy it is to fine tune the miter angle just a scosh off the stop.Hitachi stops are not as agressive as Bosch...but I think they are easier to override.
Makita.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
I would really like Makita if it had a D handle. Do you find this a benefit?
The Makita handle is quite similar to that of the Dewalt, albeit in the vertical position as opposed to Dewalts horizontal. If I'm gonna "pick nits", I'd consider it closer to a true "D" handle than Dewalts....ala, one you'd find on a router.
Given the choice between Dewalt and Makita, I'll take the Makita. (Even if I prefered the position of the Dewalt handle, which I don't know that I do.)
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
You dont like Bosch? I'm stuck between Bosch and Makita. Why do you like Makita?
Honestly don't know enough about the Bosch. They only became a "player" in the CMS market recently.
Makita designed the first dual bevel slider and I believe they've continually improved upon it.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
I have a 12" mak scms as well, but it's getting old and starting to go thru parts, so I've been looking for a replacement for a while. It's narrowed down to the Bosch 12" scms, and another Mak, with Mak taking an edge.
The advantage the Mak has, imho, is that it has a more compact footprint than the Bosch. And when you have to make the most of the space in your vehicle, every square (and cubic) inch matters. And although I haven't checked the statistics, I believe the Bosch is heavier, though I could be wrong. (I've lifted the Bosch at a show, and it seemed heavier. Or maybe it was the price tag weighing it down...)
On the other hand, if I wasn't so concerned about weight and footprint size (I take out the saw at the beginning of the day and put it back in the van at the end of the day) then I would go with the Bosch. A whole lotta saw with a lot of thought built in, with hopefully the quality Bosch is known for.
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul." Invictus, by Henley.
I have the Bosch 10" slider, and it works great. It is heavy, but worth it.
That said, I wouldn't buy the 12" seems like they are having trouble with the arbor for some reason. A read a few negative posts about the 12".
View Image
Edited 2/9/2006 4:30 pm ET by dustinf
Edited 2/9/2006 4:31 pm ET by dustinf
I hadn't heard about the trouble with the 12". What seems to be the problem? Bearings, too much runout, ? Twelve inches is a lot of steel rotating at a pretty quick pace. I've launched a few scraps into geodesic orbit. You learn to keep the saw down until it comes to a complete stop with the seats in the fully upright position and table trays up.
It would be tough giving up the capacity of the 12 inch, though. I use that saw for everything from framing to crown, and the 12" blade makes quick work of a lot of everything in between.
"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul." Invictus, by Henley.
Run out seems to be the main problem.
Here's a link to one of the discussions on JLC. http://forums.jlconline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29233&highlight=bosch
Man, reading through this thread, seems like the Bosch has some issues.
seems like the Bosch has some issues.
I've had good luck with my 10". The up front bevel control is the cat's a$$. To be honest, I would have bought a smaller blade size if they sold one. Just because it makes a nicer cut.
You can't go wrong with Makita, or Hitachi.
So now the question arises. Dewalt, Makita or Bosch. I've seen some so so reviews on the Bosch. I like the Makita but I prefer the D handle. Anyone have any preferences?
Yup and dont forget 7 day service from their many centers .
Dewalt
Tim
Dewalt is good and solid. dont like the depth gauge on bosch ( it slips under pressure) but all the adjustments out front are nice. havent found a makita I like so if I had my choice I'd break the bank and get a new laser guided hitachi with a digital read out. Romer has it you only live once. But what do they know and who are they anyways
Ya know , those are supposed to be nice saws and have great reviews.
But look at that tiny fence ;
http://www.heavydutytools.net/Scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=89
I would think they would get a kneee jerk over that but other than that its a nice saw.
Tim
They have extensions for the fence to make it higher.
They have extensions for the fence to make it higher.
Yes that Im sure they sell.
You get the dewalt fence with the price of the saw and then if you want a smaller fence you can take a lot of it off .
The saw market is the same war. Used to you could get all the attachments or the stand for the DW table saw. Now you have to shop for the stand comming with it . I bought my saw from Lowes becuswe the stand came with it and then they didnt want to give it to me . So the other saw makers are moving saws letting the accessories go.
I like the makita slider , but its anymore a bare bones saw.
Tim
It looks like a good one. But, you're right; they need to include more of the stuff you need to make it a complete, usable saw instead of piecing it out like they do.
FYI, my local HD in Michigan is closing out ther DeWalt miter saws. They have a 12" single bevel for $200, and the 12" CMS for $500. You might want to check if your's is doing the same thing.
Which saws are they closing out? The 705S and 708? If so they are really behind, all the HD locations I checked did that before Christmas.
Three years ago I bought a Porter-Cable 12" cms..am totally happy with it and have done a ton of trim work as well as just some everyday stuff. I'm not a pro, just like messing around. I also bought the Rigid Msuv, foldup/roll a way that I mounted this saw to. After some heart surgery I couldn't lift much for a while and this saved my bacon. Easy setup, easy move, easy load into my truck and very stable under most conditions. I'd get them both again. I've had not service problems, yet, on the cms so can't comment on their network. The saw was $300 then and excellent quality.
I think if you do anything at all you need both.
You need a 12 inch chop saw period to throw around in the truck and a cheap stand at least. We will call that the mobile unit.
You need a 12 inch slider dual bevel to set up in the shop or extended stay finish work. You also need a very nice stand thats long that will do repeat work.
Tim
I have the Hitachi 10" dual compound slider and I love it. It will cut just about anything and cut it cleanly. That being said, I've considered a couple of the 12" saws but the ones that I tried had way too much run-out. especially when cutting a compound mitre in hard stock like oak. I think that a 12" blade just flexes too much.
BILL
Well, after giving this some serious thought and reading all of your comments I think i'm going to pass on the slider and get a 12 CMS (possibly a double bevel). I'm surprised to read that people had problems with the Bosch. Anyone know if those issues have been corrected? Is it me or does the Mak look like it has a very small fence?
Any additional info on a regular 12 CMS? Should I consider going with a 10"? What exactly is "runout" anyway?
Makita does have a small fence.....but that's what a dual bevel slider is best at.....cutting on the flat. No reason for a high fence...it only gets in the way.
Previous employer had the Dewalt. Very high fence....I was constantly having to move it out of the way of the saw head.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
No problems with my Bosch 10" slider. Its a great machine, solid, quiet, accurate. Love it."he...never charged nothing for his preaching, and it was worth it, too" - Mark Twain