OK, whats the trick? Even with the water off it seems to drip water forever. I finally got it but I was beginning to thing it was generating its own water somewhere along the run. Any trick to keeping it dry while soldering or do you just let it trickle untill it’s done and not be impatient? Thanks.
Charlie
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Replies
2 tricks:
1) solder a union in place and just thread the union closed when done
2) put a piece of bread, yes bread, white bread preferred, to the part that is leaking water and it will absorb the drip long enough to solder the joints. When you turn the wtaerr in will push the bread trhough the line. Just remove the filter where the bread will end up.
Alex
The answer is bread, the white pappy stuff that jams in the roof of your mouth.Don't use crust !Cramb it into the pipe ,solder the joint .Then remove the nearest aerator open the tap and turn on the mains. The bread blows out into the sink
Consider using a wet vac to suck out as much water as possible, then solder quickly.
Charlie,
Your dripping problem is a common one. Even after a valve has been shut off and the line opened so it can drain, water can still be trapped in the piping. This shows up as a slow but annoying drip that makes sweating a horizontal joint difficult.
There is a technique I've used in my 25 years as a Pipefitter for General Motors that works well to solve this problem. Get yourself some Wonder Bread (or similar white bread) to use as a temporary "plug." DO NOT use wheat bread or bread with grain pieces in it, for these will not seal properly.
Start out by removing the crust, and wadding the bread up in a fairly dense ball just bigger than the inner diameter of the copper pipe. Push the ball into the pipe with your finger as far as you can, taking care not to cut your finger on the sharp edge of the opening. You also want the bread to be as far from the heat as possible.
The water contacting the bread causes the bread to swell, which will seal off the pipe for a few minutes and allow you to sweat the joint. Once the bread becomes saturated and falls apart, or you turn the water back on, the bread dissolves and the tiny pieces will flow through your piping system. They are so small they won't clog any fixtures. You get only a few minutes with this system, but it works!
There is a product I've seen at home centers that looks like soft golden eggs that come in the same size as copper pipe. If you are sweating 1/2", you buy a bag of 1/2" plugs. These also swell on contact with water and will plug the pipe for a few minutes. These dissolve completely, leaving nothing in your piping system.
I hope this helps!
Carl
Hey Carl...welcome to the site. So why is your thumb flat? Smack it too many times?
f.t. I've often used bread when sweating a joint and wondered where the idea came from and what was on the mind of the first person to use this method , any Idea?
anxiety, depression and quitting time
That was a little serious ,but very well said.
Thanks.
CS, the bread is the easiest low tech, low cost method.
BUT!!!
The Tool junkie approved method is a new system that uses nitrogen to freeze a plug in the pipe to stop the water. You can solderabout six inches awayfron the freeze ring.
The kit comes with rings to fit all the common pipe sizes up to 6"
best part is they only cost about 5000$
Some may balk at the price, but it is worth it to have the BADDEST plumbing tool available!!
Mr Tool
Do not try this at home!
I am a trained professional!
And I suppose you could drop on of those frozen rings down a plumber's crack for entertainment?
Joe H
I guess weve covered bread ! I thought I knew a secret ! LOL!
A plummer told me once repairing water lines that were frozenthawed that feral unions were the quickest way to get the job done with water in the pipes. A little costly though, but so was he!
He used to be a doctor but couldnt make any money.
hahaha
Tim Mooney
Edited 1/14/2003 1:19:27 AM ET by Tim Mooney
Glad to see this thread - I have had multiple encounters w/ repairing or needing to connect to horizontal copper lines running through concrete slab and hate every encounter with it. I usually shop-vac water out of the line but my problem is getting solder to flow into the bottom of the joint, it's hard to get a torch down and not burn off the terrible water-soluble flux that is the only product available for sweating in my area. So my interim solution has been a plastic compression fitting for 1/2" CTS and brass Mueller/Ford compression fittings for 3/4" CTS. It seems like my problem is the concrete draws off too much heat and I burn the flux off, I know mechanicals use a heat-stop when brazing to keep heat from flowing out to other joints.
Anybody have experience with the plastic compression products? They are used in PEX cold/hot domestic water systems and the mfg says good for copper. They don't make 1/2" brass compression as far as I know, I am a little leary of the plastic. I have a job w/ an open trench and the plastic fittings on, planning to keep it open a week or so and see how they do before packing them in sand and concreting over. The brand says "not approved for in-the-wall applications", a little worrisome.
"They don't make 1/2" brass compression as far as I know"
Nope, its 5/8s that fits the outside of 1/2 copper. ID of the fitting to fit OD of the pipe. 3/4 to 7/8, and so on.
Tim Mooney
It's .63 actual od of CTS 1/2" copper, but still..
does anyone know of a brass compression fitting for it? 3/4" CTS compression fittings in brass are very common for buried applications, our water co requires them underground. But no one runs 1/2" copper service.
I just watched a This Old House episode tonight that used the plastic Pex fitting you mentioned. The plumber slid the collar over the Pex, used a special tool to expand the interior of the Pex, which expanded the collar, too, and just slid this over the copper fitting. He said you had to wait about a minute for the Pex/collar to shrink back to their original size. Richard Trethewey, the resident plumber, said this method had been in use in Europe for years, and that the Pex company had a test joint of this type pressureized with hot water continuously for the last 23 years, and no leaks!
That's Wirsbo PEX flatthumb...and it's used completely in my house. So far, it's sweet! Been used in Europe for quite some time...and I think they say something like over 2 Billion feet installed with no problem from tube failure. Seems to me to be the future.
Expansion tool sets ya back about $200 or so...but then you're all set.
I had the same problem a short time ago trying to sweat a horizontal connection in a cold water pipe in the basement. The connection was at the same elevation as the pipe that came out of the HW heater. Although the water had been off for a good 10 minutes and I had all the taps open, it kept dripping out. I then drained some water out of the HW heater and the dripping stopped.
qh, same situation I had. Long horizontal run coming off the HW heater. The thing was driving me crazy... the never ending drip.
Faced with a similar situation, way back when I did maintenance as a local bar, I tried the bread trick on a drain line. The bread gave up before I got everything lined up. It was an odd position in a tight spot.
After thinking for a bit I went out to my car, was working out of a car back then, and grabbed a condom. I blew it up a bit bigger than the pipe and stuffed it into position with a broom handle. It held water for at least 20 minutes. Once the joint was made I came in with an electricians snake and, after modifying the tip to make a point that would ride centered in the pipe, I popped the condom from a threaded connection and washed it out by turning on the water.
In my on again, off again, career as a plumber I used this trick three times. Always worked but then again the smallest pipe was 3/4". It also worked on a drain lines where I just let the condom wash away.
Even if this doesn't work for you it does make a handy excuse, should the issue come up with the wife or girlfriend, for having condoms on your truck. May keep you out of hot water both ways.