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Came across this from a friend. The following is the actual text from an EBay auction where this guy is trying to sell Gold Leaf scraps to any willing buyer….from a job 14 yrs ago refinishing a weathervane…did he leaf the weathervane with a paint roller? $9.98 and you can have it…
>>It is the material left from stripping down to bare metal, the weathervane and 3 large balls from trinity church in newport RI., during the 1987 restoration, the weathervane is 6’6” long by 2’6” wide, the first globe was 14” in diameter, the second was26”, the third was about 36” in diametir and as high, all of these components were stripped down to bare metal and re-gold leaffed by myself, I saved every drop of what was removed with the hope I could recover what must have been 7 or more gld leaf jobs over the 3oo year history, plus several repair jobs, and also saved every sheet of paper that held a scrap of gold during the leaf job, as I remember it took 6-8 BOXES, not books to refinish the weahervane and the balls. Most of the work was done on the ground where saving the waste was easy; however, two full books of brand new gold leaf did rip out of my and my helpers hands on the sunday afternoon before the staging was to come down, we simply watched helplssly as the sheets pulled singualarly from the books in the brilliant sunshine, on the ground it was calm but at 180 feet there were 50 mile winds, and we laughed how it would rain pure gold in newport that day Sorry, I was running on! What I have is a 5 gallon paint bucket, filled 1’2 way with a dry spoungy residue and all the paper scraps from the new gold leaf. Also included,the resulting residues from some misguided experiments to seperate the gold from the waste, after acid ; and caustic failed; i tried heat and wound up with a silvery grey/green metalic chuncky powder,about a shot glass full. This was as a test with about 1/50th of the material, it most resembles zinc slag to me, but I am apparently not a chemist, although I call myself a protective chemical applicating engeneer, I, like, paint houses and stuf. Will ship anywhere, your cost, wieght is 10-15 pounds,you get the whole bucket, and all the little experiments, plus I will answer all your questions as I hope to learn how you proceed and make out!
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1000233328
Replies
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Is he aware that gold leaf is not very many molecules thick? But if there were 3 layers over the years at a typical thickness of 1/200,000 of an inch (0.000005"), then there would be about 1.4 troy ounces of gold in the scrapings. Worth about $370 at today's prices. If he's right about 7 layers, then about $850. Less your expenses for reagents, cynanide, and electrochemical cells for electrowinning the gold out of solution. If you're good enough to do that, you are probably good enough to earn that much in less time than it would take.
I like his self-description, "I call myself a protective chemical applicating engineer, I, like, paint houses and stuff."
-David
*.. don't know about the stuff that blew away.. but the trinity steeple sure looks good from here..1987.. seems like just a couple of years ago they were working on that..to think he's been hoarding that stuff for 14 years....
*I know I have junk that I have had for more than 14 years that is not worth nearly that much and takes up more room than his 5 gallon paint bucket. Any one here who doesn't? Joe H
*I am a professional weathervane sculptor and gilder. I think the point here is be VERY careful who you hire for restoration work! I have restored many historical weathervanes. (and never required a chemistry lab) I'm only a few minutes from Trinity church. I guess it's my fault that they didn't know about me. Anyway, I'm sure they will be calling in a few years for me to repair what this "roller jockey" messed up. You will find my ad in the back of the magazine, or if permissable, I'm at http://www.netvanes.com
*Mike...amazing amount of lurkers here!!!It's a small world buddy ain't it!?near the stream,aj
*Joe, That ain't nuttin', Go over to knots and read, "stop me before I save again"
*David, nice fish. Most of the fish I've caught cost like solid gold, not leaf. What's the cost of something like that? Joe H
*Joe, @ 36" long (great catch) this striper runs about $1200. Or you can buy the ungilded verson for about $700, his pot of gold for $9.98, and with a roller and some glue you just might have something. And then again maybe NOT! Just kidding. I make it in a 24" size also. See all the prices, finishes and options @ http://www.crosswinds-gallery.com/catalog/page19/page19.htm Thanks, Dave
*David,Please go post this in the gallery as well.Great work.b : )
*David, I couldn't get your site to open, (Sunday AM), but would like to see more of your work. Is this a server problem, or something?
*Qtrmeg, I tried it myself and it seemed to be fine. The server I'm on is awesome. I've never been down as to the best of my knowledge. Often the problem is paths. Try connecting again. If you still have a problem, it could be in your cache, try again by holding the shift and ctrl keys simultaneously then click reload. I have two sites and three URL's you can try. http://www.netvanes.com , http://www.crosswinds-gallery.com , and http://www.weathervanesbyferro.com . Good luck, and please, please email me if you still have trouble. Here is a restoration I did last summer. The horse is 42" long and over a century old. I should look so good. Dave
*b WBA At Your ServiceDavid, How much gold (in weight) does it take to cover that 36" fish ? How is it applied ? I'm not looking to steal your business, it's just that I've never seen gilding done. Great job !
*Tim; If I remember this correctly, gold leaf weight is sold in grams per 1000 leaves. The gold leaf I use is, on average, about 18 grams/1000. A pack (box) of gold is 500 leaves packaged into 20 books of 25 leaves each. Each leave measures an average of 3-1/4" to 3-3/8" square. It takes about 3 books (the better the gilder, the less gold wasted, [6-8 boxes-yikes!]) to cover this 36" striper. So about 1.35 grams. As precious metals go, that is not a lot of money in gold. The cost involved is the difference between a butcher and a surgeon or a "protective chemical applicating [applications?] engeneer [engineer?]" and a Gilder. Training and Experience! I have trained under both Paul White who has written books on the subject and Jon' Philibert from the Smithsonian's restoration department while he taught at RISD. I have gilt hundred's of weathervanes and I guarantee my work. But I digress. The first step in gilding is crucial. The copper MUST be chemically and mechanically cleaned. Immediately after, high quality zinc chromate primer or equivalent should be applied. Size (the oil varnish/glue) is applied about 24 hours later. The next crucial step is "knowing" when to apply the leaf, and what type of leaf to apply. There are two kinds of leaf for this application; "surface" and "patent" Surface is Loose on the page. Patent is fixed, placed and rubbed off onto the gilding surface. (we simply watched helplssly [helplessly?]as the sheets pulled singualarly [singularly?]from the books in the brilliant sunshine) If I'm gilding outdoors I use patent, enough said there. The surface is covered one leave at a time. And it can be tedious and take lots of time. Again here is where the cost comes from. The surface is then blended, and burnished to resemble solid gold (if you are good enough). To learn more I have a page on my site @ http://www.crosswinds-gallery.com/dfpages/dfpage3.html and I also give one day workshops teaching the art of gilding http://www.crosswinds-gallery.com/workshops_menu.htm Thanks for the great question! Here is a Pic. of me and a apprentice leafing as part of restoring a 191 year old weathervane for a Hartford Ct. church. The vane was originally made and gilded by William Wadsworth himself. Dave
*Tim; If I remember this correctly, gold leaf weight is sold in grams per 1000 leaves. The gold leaf I use is, on average, about 18 grams/1000. A pack (box) of gold is 500 leaves packaged into 20 books of 25 leaves each. Each leave measures an average of 3-1/4" to 3-3/8" square. It takes about 3 books (the better the gilder, the less gold wasted, [6-8 boxes-yikes!]) to cover this 36" striper. So about 1.35 grams. As precious metals go, that is not a lot of money in gold. The cost involved is the difference between a butcher and a surgeon or a "protective chemical applicating [applications?] engeneer [engineer?]" and a Gilder. Training and Experience! I have trained under both Paul White who has written books on the subject and Jon' Philibert from the Smithsonian's restoration department while he taught at RISD. I have gilt hundred's of weathervanes and I guarantee my work. But I digress. The first step in gilding is crucial. The copper MUST be chemically and mechanically cleaned. Immediately after, high quality zinc chromate primer or equivalent should be applied. Size (the oil varnish/glue) is applied about 24 hours later. The next crucial step is "knowing" when to apply the leaf, and what type of leaf to apply. There are two kinds of leaf for this application; "surface" and "patent" Surface is Loose on the page. Patent is fixed, placed and rubbed off onto the gilding surface. (we simply watched helplssly [helplessly?]as the sheets pulled singualarly [singularly?]from the books in the brilliant sunshine) If I'm gilding outdoors I use patent, enough said there. The surface is covered one leave at a time. And it can be tedious and take lots of time. Again here is where the cost comes from. The surface is then blended, and burnished to resemble solid gold (if you are good enough). To learn more I have a page on my site @ http://www.crosswinds-gallery.com/dfpages/dfpage3.html and I also give one day workshops teaching the art of gilding http://www.crosswinds-gallery.com/workshops_menu.htm Thanks for the great question! Here is a Pic. of me and a apprentice leafing as part of restoring a 191 year old weathervane for a Hartford Ct. church. The vane was originally made and gilded by William Wadsworth himself. Dave
* The Bucket-O-Gold has a selling bid!I wonder what this buyer is thinking.
*DavidF: I just researched the ebay high bidder's (userID=duner) last dozen transactions. He appears to sell jewelry of varying quality and to buy tacky and mismatched lots of gold jewelry, presumably for the gold content since he also has bought scrap gold in the past. At $10, it is certainly worth someone's bother IF they have a recycling scheme already set up. -DavidT
*b WBA At Your ServiceDavid, Thanks for taking the time to give us all a little insight into this beautiful art. Your post is a shining example of what makes this site a great place. Now, can you get the leaves to stick to a pair of my jockey shorts ?
*David,Thanks for the posts, the pics, and the links to your site. Fascinating info and great work!Rich Beckman
*Tim, why gild the shorts? Joe H
*i Now, can you get the leaves to stick to a pair of my jockey shorts ? You ought to feel gilty for being so vane.
*Tim, Actually the Chinese were weaving gold fibers into their eveningwear about a thousand years ago. So, I'm sorry but that already has a patent.
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Came across this from a friend. The following is the actual text from an EBay auction where this guy is trying to sell Gold Leaf scraps to any willing buyer....from a job 14 yrs ago refinishing a weathervane...did he leaf the weathervane with a paint roller? $9.98 and you can have it...
>>It is the material left from stripping down to bare metal, the weathervane and 3 large balls from trinity church in newport RI., during the 1987 restoration, the weathervane is 6'6'' long by 2'6'' wide, the first globe was 14'' in diameter, the second was26'', the third was about 36'' in diametir and as high, all of these components were stripped down to bare metal and re-gold leaffed by myself, I saved every drop of what was removed with the hope I could recover what must have been 7 or more gld leaf jobs over the 3oo year history, plus several repair jobs, and also saved every sheet of paper that held a scrap of gold during the leaf job, as I remember it took 6-8 BOXES, not books to refinish the weahervane and the balls. Most of the work was done on the ground where saving the waste was easy; however, two full books of brand new gold leaf did rip out of my and my helpers hands on the sunday afternoon before the staging was to come down, we simply watched helplssly as the sheets pulled singualarly from the books in the brilliant sunshine, on the ground it was calm but at 180 feet there were 50 mile winds, and we laughed how it would rain pure gold in newport that day Sorry, I was running on! What I have is a 5 gallon paint bucket, filled 1'2 way with a dry spoungy residue and all the paper scraps from the new gold leaf. Also included,the resulting residues from some misguided experiments to seperate the gold from the waste, after acid ; and caustic failed; i tried heat and wound up with a silvery grey/green metalic chuncky powder,about a shot glass full. This was as a test with about 1/50th of the material, it most resembles zinc slag to me, but I am apparently not a chemist, although I call myself a protective chemical applicating engeneer, I, like, paint houses and stuf. Will ship anywhere, your cost, wieght is 10-15 pounds,you get the whole bucket, and all the little experiments, plus I will answer all your questions as I hope to learn how you proceed and make out!
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1000233328