I promised I would get back before winter on my decision on a stairbuilding seminar during a shoulder operation recovery. I am putting my shoulder operation off as its not bothering me that much. I have added onto my stairshop…and the workout hasnt given me any problems.
I would love to do a seminar sometime as there was so much interest shown here. I am still considering having one, without a shoulder operation. I am super swamped for right now, but on the other hand, with several projects going on in my shop this winter,,,that would take care of having some actual demonstrations of my somewhat simple methods.
I am also wrestling with the problem of would I be a good enough teacher to make the cost worthwhile? I am a very patient person piddling around in my shop. I have some backward ways and am slow to adapt to newer methods. I tend to want to come up with ways to do a task by improvising instead of buying some fancy tool.
This has kept my overhead way down, and my production also, but I cant complain. My stairshop is 100% of our family income, and it is very laid back. I have set myself up more of a ‘watching glue dry” mode instead of a “killing snakes” mode to make a living.
I am struggling with how to convey this successfully in a stair seminar that I would like to hold sometime.
I am hesitant because I am afraid many would go away and think, “wow, this guy has a different mindset that wont work in my world”.
So, I am just putting this out in front, so should I decide on having a stairbuilding seminar, I would be wanting some inputs from prospective attendees.
I assure you that when I decide to have one, I will have a huge thread dedicated to what you would expect during each day of a five day seminar.
Replies
Stan,
You are gonna have a bunch of us camping out by your stairshop sign...waiting to get tickets. Might look like a Green Bay Packers game day tailgater in you driveway.
Still very interested here,
Brian
stan.... i'd be thinking of sending my young guy... putting the knowledge where it would do the most good
former CB.... four years of working with Roy... he;s got the mindset and the patience
Stan, the few workshops I've attended were a draw at first because of the products involved. After attending them, I'd have to say that getting to know the methods and mindset of the craftsman was easily as interesting and important.
For me, a loosely structured A to Z would be cool. My impression is you're a better teacher than you might think. The fact that you'd consider doing it at all suggests to me you'd like to educate others.
If you decide to do it, I'd really make an effort to attend.
Everything will be okay in the end. If it's not okay, it's not the end.
Stan, your 'somewhat simple methods' obviously work well, as the work you post here demonstrates - I'm sure there would be plenty of interested folks wanting to learn more from you - myself included.
Based on your picture posting and your patient answers to the many questions you get, I would bet you'd make a great teacher.
Mike
Stan, as to looking too simple or dissappointing some people, let me say you really can't.
I've watched Maloof's films many times and I'm still amazed at what that goober has achieved watching his methods. More than that I'm amazed and reaffirmed that my goobery ways are fine. All of us can be criticised and dismissed easily but it's what we produce at the end of the day that says how good we are. Your stairs as I've seen over the years are your best witness to the fact you have something valuable to share, without polish.
I for one would like very much to set in on one of your seminars warts and all.
As to inputs I'd be most interested in the shop flow.
The process, from measure to first nail or screw to last sand and install.
I'm quite skilled enough with woodworking. I don't need a refresher in tablesaw 101 but if there is a unique way of using a tool that benefits this construction, cool.
Info about where to worry or where not to care much in the process.
Maybe sharing trade secrets like specialty screws, glues or bending techniques, etc.
This is all very interesting.
Edited 11/11/2008 4:02 pm by jagwah
...i'll trade you a vote for a spot ;-)
j
(i'm still votin' for you anyway, but i thought i'd give it a shot)
...you will be including a 'copter ride too, right?
Jay
I have added onto my stairshop
Did you move the copter out, or is it still there?
Either way, I'm sure you could do a great job. I've spent two weeks at Marc Adams school of woodwork. This by no means makes me an expert, but I have personally met 6 different "expert" instructors. They are definetely masters in their fields, but they are not expert teachers. Either way, the instruction I went through will forever be invaluable.
They have their own way of doing things, some slow, some speedy. I've seen the work you do through your many pictures. You have more to share then could ever be absorbed in just a week long class, regardless of your methods.
What do you need to hear from the BT masses to convince you that you should do this?
Joe
Joe: I have heard more than enough to convince me to have a seminar. I want it done right, and have everyone feel they spent their money well.
I will admit I am a very patient guy on most areas of my profession. Sure, I have my moments, but know when I need to back up and slow down a little.
My son Jeff comes from a high stress supervisors job managing 43 people. He works part-time in my stairshop now, and I never will forget his first day. I had given him a task, and he wanted to know how long it should take him. I just replied, " as long as it takes to get it done". He didnt accept that answer, so then he asked me how long I would take. I just quickly replied, "as long as it takes to get it done." He said...."How do you stand this high stress in your stairshop?"
I just told him we are out here just working leisurely, and not like we are killing snakes. He still shakes his head. He comes from work so wound tight, you could play tunes on him, but he mellows out after his 3 hour stress relief session in his dads shop!
Back to the seminar topic;;;;
I am contemplating not only having my usual in progress stairs going.... but some hypothetical projects...such as building the forms for a curved curb type stringer that I just posted in my "flared maple stairway" thread. I think filleting out sections of stairways, and showing how I would go about making it would be a better use of everyones time.
One of my favorite things to do is start with a blank piece of paper, and figuring out a curved stairway that would go in the space allowed. You would not believe the little tricks one learns to get a stairway to fit into some tight spots.
I feel I could have a nice board set up with a felt tip pen and we could go through all the steps fitting a stairway mathematically as the attendees could throw hypotheticals at me... I love doing the laying out part of a stairway as much as building it.
They say a stairway well planned out is half done. I believe that!
Let me get this DeWalt contest out of my mind after Dec 15th...and I promise I will determine before Christmas if I am going to do this...and what month during the winter.
I cant say how much I appreciate the encouragement from all of you wanting to attend such a seminar of mine. If you guys really knew me, I honestly feel I am not really a master of my trade...but just very proficient. I can also say that my work is by no means perfect, you cant always go by pictures. I have a fine balance in my trade of getting a stairway done, doing a nice job, but not being radical about absolute perfection. I just have to settle for 90% sometimes.
Now, back when I was making my Kentucky Longrifles....there was no time limit....no money to be made as it was strictly a hobby and a passion of mine. I would spend twice the hours on one rifle that I could build two curved stairways.
I guess thats why I am so unaccepting of the word stairmaster as I know I do not put the finesse into my stairways as my rifles I handcrafted out of exquisite chunks of curly maple.
I never considered myself a riflemaking master either... because I go to the National muzzleloading shoots, and you would not believe the absolute flawless work on some of the muzzleloaders I have seen. I swore some had to be made by God himself they were so absolutely perfect no matter how close you looked.
Being exposed to the best woodworkers I believe on this planet will always keep me humble as I never in 100 lifetimes could reproduce what I have personally seen with my own eyes.
So,,,maybe where I am coming from has been better explained finally! I am not a stairmaster, and there are without a doubt hundreds of stairbuilders that should be in my DeWalt spot.
Stan
Edited 11/11/2008 9:03 pm ET by StanFoster
Gee, Stan I never really thought of you as a Stairmaster, anyway!
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000NZKXNG
Everything will be okay in the end. If it's not okay, it's not the end.
Each person is going to want a little something different, IMO.
For me, knowing jack about a stair, would want to start from your idea or mind to paper to material.
I would want to start from square one to the finished product if possible in the whole seminar.......
Down to riser height, step depth, curves, hand rails, balusters, jigs, etc......
So I guess for someone like me, a novice around stairs but not tools could this be achieved in a timely manner? one week? two weeks? A month? I don't have a clue.
I respect your work style as a total less stress environment but in a seminar much would have to be packed in to get as much of your intelligence and craftsmanship on the subject soaked into a small amount of time as I personally have work commitments and responsibilities of my own for my family.
I guess one possible scenario would be to find a project or job that could finished in a certain time period that would be reasonable to everyone and then ask for members to attend to accomplish the task from start to finish. Obviously 4 or 5 more people at your shop would finish the project quicker.
Or if there was a lot of people wanting to participate in this seminar and some are already stair builders maybe look into having two classes. One for novices, one for advanced individuals that already have the basics down and wants to learn your obviously advanced stair designs.......
“Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem.” Reagan....
Failure is the condiment that gives success its flavor. -Truman Capote
Stan I've learned so much from your pictures I would love to spend some time in your shop with you as the teacher and from your posts you are already a good teacher. I've been learning all along for free though so you need to quit posting pictures if you want me to pay to learn!:)
Stan- I'd be interested in your seminar. I've built stairs, but nothing compared to what you do.
And I like your work attitude. Mine's similar. I do have to give proposal prices for my customers, but if I feel like quitting early because I'm tired, or have something else to do, and its going to take me a little longer...
Well, that's OK. I'd rather enjoy what I do, than get all stressed out about falling behind on the job.
Why would I need to take your seminar when I can buy the pre-cut, pressure treated ones at the Depot?
Just kidding Stan, obviously you have shown your talent, what better resume/advertising for a seminar could you ask for? Your simplistic methods are what most of us that don't have a tool sponsorship need in order to stay efficient and profitable.
I would be looking at my availability schedule as soon as you post the dates.
Stan,
To help you decide whether or not to do this, have you considered getting in touch with other folks who already teach, or offer training workshops in the trades? There's all kinds of ads in FWW/FHB on various workshops.
Or considered getting some production support from a known entity like, hmm, Taunton?
Maybe you could start with a short video that can be used as potential marketing materials.
Dunno, just thinking out loud.
Good luck with the Dewalt contest. You've got my vote.
Stan Iknow you've been busy with the contest and all but winter is the 21 you know.any more thoughts on a seminar?
Mike- I promised a decision by winter...and yes..that is the 21st. I am trying to convince myself or better said..prepare such a seminar so it will be a worthwhile investment for all. It wont be cheap....and I just want to be best prepared. I am still milling ideas around in my head.
Stan
Hey I'll vote for you, but you ain't gettin' me to go to school. ; ^ )
Mike
Small wheel turn by the fire and rod, big wheel turn by the grace of god.
The key to teaching a seminar is to have a full master plan laid out in front of you. At first it may seem a little uncomfortable, if you're not used to being in front of people like a classroom, but if you do more of them you will eventually ease into it and find what you can and can't do.
Follow the plan and only stray from it a bit if you find the crowd wants to. Each room of people is different and you will find 99 to 100% of them want it to be a good experience. The 1% are usually the egotists that think they know more and want to show that to the rest, but they seldom are there.
Come up with a good plan and learn to keep your eye on the clock.
What did you do to your shoulder? Roto cuff? I tore mine and didn't have the operation...doc said it was my choice. That was 15 years ago. 3 years ago I re-injured it and the pain came on with a vengeance. Just recently, (3 months). I have started swimming almost every day and I am completely pain free now.
I've always been an avid runner, but really can't anymore, so I switched to swimming and it has worked much better for me.