I have built maybe 15 stairs in my life, all the while admiring the skill and precision that guys who do this day in and out exhibit. Lately with the economy the way it is I have been doing as much work as I can to save money and last week I found myself looking at an an existing stairway that needed to be reframed for both comfort and code compliance.
I had a pretty tight area to work in so in order for the stairs to be in code they had to use up all of the available run so precision was the word of the day. I measured everything down to the 1/16″ of an inch and got my calculator out, drawing a shop plan in the process. I figured that the best course of action would be to build the stairs and balustrade in my shop where I could confirm all of the measurements and get the close tolerances I needed.
I carefully laid out the first stringer, taking into account saw kerf and other potential compounding errors, and started making cuts after first triple checking my math. Damn this is where all the years of experience comes to bear, so I thought.
After cutting the stringer to size and filing off some rough spots with a rasp I positioned the stringer upright in my shop and dropped a plumb line down from the top step to the floor, taking out my tape and measuring the total run. Success, I was about an 1/8″ of an inch from where I needed to be. The total rise was similarly within acceptable tolerance.
As I sat there admiring my craftsmanship and the accolades that would surely follow, something caught my attention and I referenced my shop drawing and discovered a critical error. The first step, where my plumb line was attached, was what I measured as total rise, laying out my stringer accordingly, but that measurement was floor to floor, meaning my stringer had an extra step… or in other words, given the peculiarities of the original stairs, I managed to, with great care mind you, recreate in my shop the stairs I was trying to replace. Brilliant.
As I pulled another 16′ 2×12 out and revisited my shop drawing something occurred to me. “You dumba$$, the total rise for these stairs was not changing, nor were the number of steps, so you could of just measured the original stairs and used that rise as the measurement for the new stairs.” Given the number of steps staying constant, as well as the rise for each step, all I really needed to do to lay out this stringer was divide my total run by the number of steps I knew I was going to use and I’d be good to go.
I took a job that was exceptionally straightforward and made it really difficult all because “stairs are supposed to be challenging”.
Replies
sounds about right
i'd put my total stairways at somewhere around 100... funny thing is I like stairs... I like figure'n the run/ rise... my options... and i like cutting them... it can be years between sets... ot it can be like my loft project and have 2 sets none of them exactly the same... i even welded up my first spirial and my largest to date... a 56 rise run with 6 landings... it's all simple math and for me alot of thinking and drawing... but seems to always work out... I'm a 2 on the stan foster 10 scale of stair building with stan being a 9.99...
but it's something i never shy away from and to even teach to others.... basic stair lay out with run & rise... I've seen very skilled guys have a fear of it...
glad it worked out for you... like anything... if you do it everyday you have to think less about how
P:)
I'm sure this was debated a couple years ago. If you're gonna call it the Stan Foster scale then Stan's a 10 on it, by definition. Then again, he's a 10 on most any stairmaking scale.
i left him room to grow <g>
I've done similar, in a similar situation. Sometimes it seems that what really determines our mettle as a craftsman is how we handle the goof-ups we ourselves create.
"...craftsmanship is first & foremost an expression of the human spirit." - P. Korn
CaliforniaRemodelingContractor.com
I have ADD and it was never diagnosed until our oldest son was having problems in 1st grade and the teacher 'informed' us of his disabilty. In talking to doctors, I had the epiphany that I have it too.
What I have learned since then is that the most mentally challlenging jobs I have ever done seem to never have any significant errors. But, the simplist work dends to increase the odds of a major bone headed "DUH"
One of my biggest srew ups ever was working on a set of stairs. I realized that I had screwed up on the layout. I was sooooo pissed at myself. I tore everthing out and headed to the lumber yard that afternoon that is 5 hour round trip.
It wan't until about 2:00 am when I woke up and realized that I didn't screw up and I just had tore everything out and now I have to start again. Talk about being pissed at yourself and wanting to to really hurt yourself for the stupidity
I guess this is a "I screwed up thinking I screwed up"?
Ya, that could certainly give you a migraine. snorK*
Glad I'm not the only one who's ever overcorrected something not needed.
misery loves company
Stairbuilding is my weak point.
When i framed i built the stairs to the basement but we always had a Stairbuilding shop do the main stairs.
But truth be told my math stinks but i muddled through with a big divider as a old carpenter taught me.{we never had calculators}
On Stans scale i would be lucky to make cawffe for him.
thought I would update everyone, finally got around to taking some images of the stairs in question. They finished out really well, everything fit within 1/8" tolerance and they are comfortable to walk on. The final dimensions ended up coming into code compliance (the original stairs were really steep, befitting a basement access) at 7 1/2" rise and 10 1/4" run.
The railing also came out really nice, I fluted the balusters so that the fluting rises in a line rather than stair stepping. The underside is finished with bead board.
I still have wainscotting to run up the stair walls and a few pieces of trim to put on but all things considered I am happy with the whole project.
BTW, I built the stairs in my shop and installed them in one piece, building the balustrade as the last step before finishing.
Now THAT is pride in workmanship !Well done.=0)..We are smart in so many ways. Surely, we should be able to understand that in between war and passivity, there are a thousand possibilities. ~Howard Zinn..You are always welcome at Quittintime
thanks, there's no substitute for not rushing things in order to get it done right.
You got a purty.....stairway
nice work
Woodman,
Real nice job. Can you talk a bit about the newels and how you fabricated them? Looks like you applied finished material (oak?) to a post. Was wondering what the subpost was made of and how you fabricated the finished post over it (solid or ply) to allow for movement and how you attached that to the sub post..... I'm doing similar work now, and it just seems as though things move so much more than they used to given lumber quality, global warming etc. that I'm always looking for ways that work.
thanks for posting,
Frost
I attached a better picture of that box newel, you can see it in more detail.Basically the post slides into the lower box, which is just a mitered oak plywood box. The post itself is built up out of a lot of smaller pieces of oak and then I glued on some mitered 1/2" oak panels to finish it off. The lower box is 6" and the post is 4.5". I used oak plywood on that lower box to contain any movement and because for ease of installation I wanted to fit that first and then just slide in the actual post. By using smaller pieces of solid oak and changing the grain orientation around I should not have a movement problem with that either. I did leave the post a little loose, there is probably a 1/16" movement either way all around but you don't see it in finished form. Also, the moulding on that lower box is attached to the box itself, not the post. Surprisingly, once that balustrade was fitted into place the whole thing was solid as a rock even without the box newel mechanically fastened but I still countersunk two 2" screws from the lower box to the post and plugged them to ensure that nothing moved.