I’ve moved to a new area after a working lifetime in California and I’m discovering that a lot of stuff I thought was standard varies by region. And not just because of snow or other weather stuff. Like the recent “Who does the tile membrane?” discussion. So the other day I mention step shingles to the roofer and I get a blank look. Did I talk to a clueless roofer or are they a regional thing also?
Thanks, John
Replies
To answer your question, you'll have to tell me what step shingles are.
;-)
Do you mean stepping roof shingles as a method of laying them?
Step shingles are right angle pieces of sheet metal flashing woven into each course at a wall to roof rake intersection. About six inches long for asphalt shingles, 18 inches or so for shakes. Instead of having one long wall to roof angle flashing. John
john... if you had called them "step flashing" instead of "step shingles"... it might have gotten an acknowledgement
there are some areas that do not traditonally step flash
florida comes to mind.. they use one long flash and lots of roof cementMike Smith Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore
Aha, you mean step flashing.
At least that's what it's called around here.
I wonder how many use the term "queen stud" for a door or window trimmer and "jack stud" for a bench cripple?
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
What's a bench cripple? Some kinda sports injury?Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"We strive for conversion,we get lost in conversation, and wallow in consternation. "Me.
Small stud under the window bench. Cripple, Jack stud, bench trimmer, bench stud, I have worked around people who used all those terms.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
That'd be the Commodores after an LSU game, eh?:)Leon
Jacks - yes. never heard of queens.
In Texas a sheetrock dealie over cabinets was called a furrdown or soffit. Same for an architectural feature in a ceiling. Here in Va it is called a bulkhead."Put your creed in your deed." Emerson
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
I learned those terms from an old guy who framed the San Fernando valley area right after WW11. That was the terminology used by his crews back then. He also always laid walls out from inside corners at 16" o.c. made it easier on the lathers to install their wooden lathe.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
He also always laid walls out from inside corners at 16" o.c. made it easier on the lathers to install their wooden lathe.
And they weren't using plywood sheathing so who cared if the spacing didn't work outside.
You got it.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Step shingles, I was scratching my head.
Have you ever heard of laps?
Thats a new one to me. What is the translation?
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Jack studs!
I was scratching my head when I heard that one. In Syracuse all the framers use that term, don't know where or how that one started.
I was in my early twenties when I learned those terms. Acting as cut man on this old boys crew. He told me to cut some cripples (which I knew to be the short studs under a window bench)so I did.
Brought him an arm load of them and he very patiently explained to me in his best grizzled old timers tone of voice and demeanor from about 1" from my face that I had rocks for brains , cripples are what go over a header, jacks go under the bench, queens go next to the king stud and hold up a header and the kings holdup the plates.
He then asked if I now understood how things work around here.;-)
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Well I had to learn new terms when framing out there. Even though I live 50 miles from Syracuse, they all had there own terms.
It was tough to start with, but I caught on quick.
Aren't you working today?
Haven't really worked in months. Bid a winery job, got verbal acceptance, waiting on engineering, BI approval and owners financing to fall. Every week it is:
"Well this week we will have it all done and you can start" By now costs have risen and with no contract signed because of no financing in place we will have to start all over again. Sucks.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
sorry about that, I didn't remember you being online during the day.
Off and on , potsing around here and with enough small work to help defray the costs of breathing.
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Well at least you have some income! I wish I did.
Jack studs!I was scratching my head when I heard that one. In Syracuse all the framers use that term, don't know where or how that one started. That's funny, I grew up using the term (in Utica).
I wonder if it is really just a question of who ya know rather then where ya are. But different then some others, it meant the stud under the header to me.
in utica we always used jack stud, in syracuse they call it laps.
Im up a little farther in ny than you guys and Ive heard jacks and laps, but kind of assumed that laps was an older school term judging by the guys who used it
Most of the time I like hearing different terms for the same thing I find it amusing
Luckily Ive always been able to catch on quick and figure out what they are talking about, without too many questions, I think thats the key to keeping the hotheads from getting all worked up over it
but I like being the hothead<G>
you in the 1000 Islands? alex bay?
Dont work too much In alex bay really once in a while, but got one comming up. mostly around Clayon and the shore south towards Watertown .
Have actually done quite a bit on Wellesly Island but dont enjoy going over there. Still do some work around Sackets Harbor or Henderson once and a while, you familar?
my old boss owns a place on the water in alex bay.
We used to go up for a day at least once a year, stuck near home now.
Ha! Around here a bulkhead is the sloped exterior door and foundation bumpout for steps leading in to the cellar.And in the Navy knowing what and where it is can mean the difference between life and death
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Not sure if "queen stud" is some kind of reference to Calif., but I have never heard either queen or bench stud. Guys I'm working with call sheetrock backing deadwood. Or maybe I call deadwood backing.Out here, corner of Colorado, I see builders roofing completely, then coming back and cutting in the roof penetrations. Backwards to me. Plumbers and sheet metal men don't want to do the rough in before sub floor. They crawl it later by choice. John
Edited 6/6/2008 12:20 pm ET by JohnCujie
We just call them jacks, cripples, or kings. No need to waste breath on the word "stud."
Never heard of a queen (stud) or bench cripple, and don't use the term trimmer here but have heard it used elsewhere.
Laid my first shingles in '78 and spent over 20 years as a roofing sub and contractor.There are three ways I know of to do flashing on a side wall like that, step-flashing being the most common.But after working if four different regions, this is the first time I have heard it called step shingles. If you had mentioned that to me as a roofer, I would have assumed you were referring to a layout pattern called stair-stepping them.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Answer may depend on where you moved to.
I've always called them step flashing - Not step shingles.
It's pretty standard practice around here.
It may simply be that he had never heard them called step shingles. I've always heard them called step flashing. Either way, I'm sure he uses them. I don't think anyone anywhere shingles a roof without them.
Regional differences are interesting. So many variations don't seem to have any basis beyond "it's the way we've always done it here"
Ahh. Fingersandtoes. Not everyone uses step flashing.
I just ripped off and rebuilt a 2 year old roof where they did not use it. Oh, that doesnt count??
"Not everyone uses step flashing.'
I've seen some continuous flashing used over the steps as a counter-flashing, but never in place of it. No step flashing? That's just nasty.
No step flashing? That's just nasty.
In the areas of the country where tile roofs are prevelant, the single "L" flshing is more common. With tile, that's the way it's done in most cases and that detail gets carried over to shingles. If done right it works OK and it allows the siders to finish before the roof is installed. It's not often done properly with asphalt, though.http://grantlogan.net
Who got Bo Diddley's money?
2 year roof. Every nail head was rusty. Water came in "sometimes"
And the PR*CK charged the client more for the origonal roof than I charged to fix it all.
Clients fault for hiring them and my fault for not charging more.
Sometimes. Like when it rained?
It's hard to charge clients a fair price when they have already been hosed. I hope they appreciated the break you gave them.
Re. appreciating what I did. Yes, the client did appreciate it and I got a great referral from them as well.
Wont complain on that one.
In MI we called it step flashing. I've heard some call it "card flashing" there too.
Here in TX, they do what Mike said: a long strip of "L flashing". It has a small raised bead that is under the shingles. Presumably, the water that get in, will not get over that hump and onto the felt.
I don't like the system...but thats what they do. They don't have the ice damming to deal with, so it probably works. I know for sure it wouldn't work in a cold climate because the water that could get under the shingles would freeze solid and all helll would break loose.
Bob's next test date: 12/10/07
We call it step flashing, but I've heard the actual flashing pieces called "tin shingles".
http://grantlogan.net
Who got Bo Diddley's money?
step flashing.
Step flashing seems to be the consensus. When you Google step shingle, quite a few references come up, so at least I'm not alone.Don't you guys have jobs?John
Don't you guys have jobs?
I'm working as a designer/project manager, so I'm on the computer most of the day.
Stressful days I spend moments here to unwind, slow days (there aren't many) I spend moments here to kill time.
(Today's one of the former ;-)
Working is for the able bodied individuals!
Don't you guys have jobs?
Yup - this is taking a break from it. I've made 40' of built in gutter liner and metal cornice to go with it, about 300' of copper "D" drip edge, some curved apron to go around a turret, a bunch of counter flashing flags, 100' of "W" valley, and a couple of hundred "step shingles".
I've got 100' of valley and 200' of drip edge to go for 1st thing in the morning.
Don't you have a job?
edit: Oh yeah, if you know the secret handshake you get paid for posting here.
http://grantlogan.net
Who got Bo Diddley's money?
Edited 6/6/2008 3:47 pm ET by seeyou
Working four tens which is hard on an old man. Day off today. Who do I see about that check?John
Who do I see about that check?
No check - cash. See Piffin. http://grantlogan.net
Who got Bo Diddley's money?
Working four tens which is hard on an old man.
Yeah, but 4 tens reaps 3 twentyfours.http://grantlogan.net
Who got Bo Diddley's money?