Theives are having a field day stealing the copper from my underground power. They come back every week or two to hit me again. I need to keep things running on the farm so I need to replace the wire but I don’t want to just keep feeding their meth habit. Where can I find aluminum wire – or some kind of non copper wire? The critical conduit is about 250′ of 1 1/4 conduit. That pump is small. The maximum I would use on that circuit is two 1 1/2hp pumps.
They have pulled up the direct burial stuff down to about 4′ deep. Wouldn’t a productive job be less work? They ripped up the conduit about the same depth before they cut both ends and pulled out all the wire. And the sub panel.
My power company friend laughed at me saying I didn’t know how big the problem really is. But she said they are not stealing aluminum wires. If I replace with that it should stay?
An internet search revealed no suppliers of aluminum electrical wire.
Eric
Replies
Shotgun? Put the zombies out of their misery.
"Shotgun? Put the zombies out of their misery."
A little bit casual with your advice. This isn't the place for detailed discussion, but if you really decide to take on the undead, it's a mistake to think a shotgun is going to settle things with them.
"Shotgun? Put the zombies out of their misery."
A little bit casual with your advice. This isn't the place for detailed discussion, but if you really decide to take on the undead, it's a mistake to think a shotgun is going to settle things with them.
Are you kidding? I'd say a street sweeper shotgun with PLENTY of ammo would be the ideal way to cure a zombie problem.
The one thing you have to never forget is, any shot thats not a head shot is a waste of ammo...
Daniel Neumansky
Restoring our second Victorian home this time in Alamdea CA. Check out the blog http://www.chezneumansky.blogspot.com/
Oakland CA
Crazy Homeowner-Victorian Restorer
Silver shot?
I'm not real up on zombies, maybe something else.
Joe H
My feeling is you are either going to be in tight with them where the shotgun is useless compared to say a samurai sword, or more desirably keeping them at a good distance where again there are better alternatives.
But hey, to each their own, it's sort of a plywood - osb thing.
I get the feeling this is someone you know...
You can get the aluminum wire/cable at Lowes or Home depot.
Politics: the blind insulting the blind.
Click here for access to the Woodshed Tavern
Go up one wire guage size over what you have, er had, in copper. Make sure you get copper to alum. splice blocks or ones rated for both.
Buy a big freakin dog, and turn him loose every night. He can't be charged with a crime.
Next time you bury it, fill the ends of the trench with concrete. Imagine how they'll feel after digging for a while only to hit a giant chunk of concrete?
Sounds like you need a tree stand and a 30.06. Go enjoy a few quiet nights by yourself.
But seriously, is there any way to energize something that they would have to touch to get to the copper? And I don't mean with 110v either.
Surely making someone pay would be more fun than getting aluminum wire!
They aren't going to know it's aluminum wire until they bring it to the scrapyard, so at least the first time around they're still going to steal it.
Put a camera out there. It is cheaper than getting robbed over and over again. X10.com has some good and cheap night vision stuff.
Yup these idiots wont know untill the damage is done. Some thieves here stole a bunch of electric trolly wire that runs overhead. Took a bunch of work. It was copper coated steel. Cost to replace ,over $20k , it was a trolly line that was being run by a non profit group.
The sad truth is there are two sides to this all too common story. First the criminals who actually steal the copper and the criminals who receive the stolen goods. I have had the misfortune of having thugs break into my home and take a major portion of the radiant heating system. 8 zones and header from the header and two manifolds. One has to wonder of complicity from the scrap dealers who accept such items. Although the concepts of a 30-06 sound good remember that our current court system is not set up to protect the innocent, any damage to a spaced out junkie would set off a firestorm of protests from the touchy feely left leaning liberal crowd. Consider how well reform programs for prisons have worked. The camera would be just something else to steal. When the police came to our home the ADT monitored alarm was going off, the monitoring folks were asleep at the switch.
You are so right about the scrap yards that buy the stuff. Around here, some theves stole tens of thousands of dollars worth of bronze urns from a cemetary. Now, no one can convince me that when they brought them to the scrap yard the guy didn't know that they were stolen! And as scrap they were worth a couple hundred dollars at most, IIRC. Scrap yards are glorified "fencing" operations and should be held responsible!
would it be possible to mark the product enabeling a trace
I'm sorry for your problems, and your losses.
Aluminum wire, in sizes of #6 and larger, is readily available. Check with a real electrical supply house; they sell it by the foot.
Contrary to another posters' rule, you probably want to go TWO sizes larger. That is, replace #10 copper with ##6 aluminum.
Also contradicting another poster, aluminum wire is distinctly different in appearance and 'feel' from copper wire. Thieves aren't likely to be confused.
DO pay particular attention to your connections, and following the instructions. Aluminum has some quirks.
The amount of effort you describe is being put into stealing your wire does suggest more than casual theft. If you have not involved law enforcement, you should.
Otherwise, with this amount of determination by the thief .... sad to say, but 'going hunting' may be your only solution. Be sure to chat with a lawyer first, and be careful to involve police in the capture, if at all possible. You will really want to be able to convince a dozen strangers that, if you did shoot someone, that you had no other choice.
in the last few years i've sufffered well over 500k in copper losses even caught some of em... the cops let em go because they didn't see em put it in the truck... but thats anothe story...
look for a deer stand camera... motion activated... they are camo'd ... i don't think they flash and besides they are prob doing it in the light of day... look on ebay under $100 at least you'll know who it is... so you can shoot the right person...
p
After you shoot him, just put an old rusty knife in his hand and tell the police he was coming after you. End of problem. Just make sure he's real dead before you call the police.
Edited 6/3/2008 6:38 pm by rasher
no body, no witness = no crime to report to the cops.
Let 'em dig the hole to steal the copper before squeezing the trigger.
Just a little back filling is all you need to do.
I have always been fond of efficiency like that!
You steal my heart away
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don't get all gushy on me
look for a deer stand camera... motion activated... they are camo'd ..walmart $49, I have one
http://www.atvresearch.com is a wholesale supplier of quality surveillance equipment.
I've done business with them without any problems. I'm not saying this is the best solution, just providing an inexpensive source if you decide to try it..
I'd suggest that, after you replace the copper wire with aluminum, you advertise that simple fact with a large sign, placed where it can be seen and read from car stopped on the road. You might also put a sample of the wire on the sign with a red arrow pointing to it.
Don't express anger or resentment on the sign, just say that this is your remedy and wish them good luck elsewhere.
Lead is non copper!!!!
Cheaper too. Give them a bunch!!!
a device that will alert you but not the thieves will allow you to put an end to their theiving.
i would not want to feed them either.
Make sure that wire is always hot- do away with the breaker, tuck the leads under the lugs before the main.
that way at least they will earn it when they take it!
Scary thing here in South Georgia recently - the idiots started stealing manhole covers from the middle of the road ! And storm drain covers, too. Caught two crack-heads with a van so loaded down with manhole covers, the rear bumper was practically dragging. Some of the covers were over a 20 foot drop. What are those things, 30 inches across ? Just about big enough for a kid on a bicycle to fall in.
I don't know if these low-rents had actually sold any, but I did see a CNN item about another community that found theirs at the scrapyard, post sale.
Greg
same issue in Atlanta and IIRC Cherokee county. They get about $15 for each cover but they have to be broken into bits and not recognizable as a man hole cover (as the articel said). That sure is a lot of work for $15. Costs the cities about $200 to get them replaced (and then welded on).
same issue in Atlanta and IIRC Cherokee county.
Yup- just a few miles from my house. So now the county has a few guys welding every manhole cover down- talk about a waste of my tax dollars. They caught a couple of the dirtbags who were doing it, so between that and the welding, I think the problem is solved, but it's still annoying."Brilliance!! That's all I can say- Sheer, unadulterated brilliance!!" Wile E. Coyote- Super Genius
Caught them? I have this image, of the perp inside the pipe ... while the cover is welded on :D
they are probably just dopers, and while it may give you some short term satisfaction to torture them, the most humane thing is to put them out of their misery.
What are those things, 30 inches across
I've always wondered what that would do to a car at say 35 mph! Think it would wake you up if you were dozzin off.
Doug
Too bad you're not in Florida. We have a "make my day" law. Confront these guys and feel threatened then shoot them. You'll walk. You are over 50 and they undoubtedly have criminal records are young and there will be more than one of them. Sounds about right to me.
We don't take that #### in Maine!!
http://kennebecjournal.mainetoday.com/news/local/5119561.html
i used to be in the car bussiness.several years ago there was a couple kids stealing cars left and right. all the dealers knew who they were,but nobody could catch them. finally one day one guy see's them walking down the street getting ready to hop a pipe rail and grab a car. so the guys on that lot were ready.the kids hoped in the car and all the salesmen got around the car with other cars.
so they grab these guys and took them out behind the dealership where a river is. they started tellling this kids how they were going to kill them and throw em in the river.[there were some firearms visible at that time],a little physycal persussion was used. one of them pized his pants he was so scared. they finally gave them a phone and had them call a det at the police station and tell him right there on the phone where all the cars were and that they were the ones that took them.
then the dealer let the police come arrest them,they were a little bloody from "falling down" but no worse for the wear.police never even ask about their condition.
i've wondered whats happened to them,i know jail didn't reform them ,but when your looking down a 357,10' from a riverbank,you might have some thoughts about what to do with the rest of your life.oh all but about 3-4 cars were returned,thats what put them in jail,selling stolen parts,here in ks stealing a car is joyriding and a misdemeanor. larryif a man speaks in the forest,and there's not a woman to hear him,is he still wrong?
Reminds me of a sad story. A young fellow was getting in trouble all the time.
Went to a party at a house on the river. Cops came but just to tell them all to keep it down a bit.
The kid thought they were after him jumped out the window into the river and drowned.
Thanks for all the input- Eric is out at the site tonight pulling more wire. Couldn't find a source for aluminum smaller than #2 in stock. He went with #10 copper running one pump only. The concrete at the ends of the conduit may slow the thieves down, we'll try that, but the repair will be harder.... It's a pretty remote site that he is not at regularly so guarding it is tough. They get caught and problem goes away for about a year. The thieves can be comically persistent, a neighbor found them trying to steal the paddlewheel scraper that takes us at least 3 hours just to start, not to mention getting the hydraulics to work...
Stan
others have had enough too....
Time to get even....
VIENNA, Maine - The owner of a machine shop where thieves stole $3,000 worth of scrap steel, iron and aluminum wasn't going to let it happen again. After Saturday night's theft, Joseph Lord loaded his shotgun and laid low, expecting the thieves to return. They came back on Tuesday, in broad daylight.
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
nothing is safe.....
CHARLESTON, Ore. - Sorry, Charlie. You're a crime victim. The blue, 8-foot wooden statue of a tuna stood for two decades at the end of a bridge, welcoming folks to the coastal fishing town of Charleston.
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
and yet again.....
DETROIT - Thieves who stole an 8-foot statue of Jesus Christ off a crucifix in Detroit may have been seeking copper to sell as scrap.
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!
http://www.kwtx.com/home/headlines/19524919.html
Here's one that put a smile on my face!
Two reasons, I'm a big Packer fan and the bad guy ends up in the hospital, tell me, how does it get any better!
(June 4, 2008) -- Green Bay Packers running back Noah Herron thwarted a would-be burglar by hitting him with a bed post during a break-in at his home.
Brown County, Wis. Sheriff Dennis Kocken said the break-in happened late last Friday and the injured the intruder remained hospitalized but is expected to recover.
"Noah Herron used necessary, reasonable and justifiable force in protecting his life and property," Kocken said in a statement.
"Herron, the victim in this random home invasion, is cooperating with law enforcement."
Herron, 26, missed all of last season with a knee injury.
Chief Deputy John Gossage said Herron called police just after 11:00pm Friday after he heard glass breaking in the lower level of his suburban Green Bay home.
He said an unknown number of people had entered the house.
One of the intruders entered Herron's bedroom, and Herron hit the person with a post he had unscrewed from his bed, Gossage said.
Herron was not injured.
The injured burglar was taken to a hospital, and a second suspect was arrested outside the home, Gossage said.
Stolen property and a vehicle believed taken earlier Friday from another home were found near Herron's home, Gossage said.
The two people in custody are suspects in numerous burglaries and home invasions throughout Brown County, he said.
Pittsburgh took Herron in the seventh round of the 2005 draft out of Northwestern.
The Packers signed him off the Steelers' practice squad in 2005.
Packers general manager Ted Thompson released a statement Tuesday, saying the team knew about the break-in and had no comment.
ON a sports page that I frequent I read comments that said that the burglars were lucky that they didn't invade any life long residents of Wisconsin, those guys all have hunting rifles at their house's.
Reminded me of the time you showed me where those guys that escaped from the TX jail got caught up there in the MT's in CO. I think you said that they picked the wrong place to go, all the locals are packing!
Doug
while these dirtbags should be thrown UNDER the jail, be careful about the amount of force you use in trying to stop them. Most states will not allow the use of deadly force to protect property. The famous situation was the use of a trip gun. Back in the 80's , a guy had an apartment in NY that was constantly being broken into when he was away for the weekends. So he sets up a trip wire attached to a shotgun. Sure enough, guy breaks in, gun goes off - no more burglar. Apartment owner was convicted of manslaughter. Courts said that if he had been home, then deadly force is appropriate. Otherwise, you can never use deadly force merely to protect property.
be careful about the amount of force you use in trying to stop them.
I'm very much in agreement with you there. When its just property the hell with it, I can always get more stuff, but when its my family then all bets are off!
I recall the incident with the trip gun, similar incident here in Iowa back in the 70's, farmer has a vacant house and is tired of people breaking in so he sets up one of these trip guns - seriously injuring the guy and eventually looses the farm and more to the same guy.
There is a law that allows you to seek shelter by whatever means reasonably necessary and I believe this is the law that allowed the man to sue. Not 100% clear on the details but you get the gist of it!
I am shocked at how brazen some thieves are now days though, a lot more home invasions with people home then there used to be, almost seams like that really isn't a concern to the thief, would be to me if I was going into that line of work!
Doug
I recall the incident with the trip gun, similar incident here in Iowa back in the 70's, farmer has a vacant house and is tired of people breaking in so he sets up one of these trip guns - seriously injuring the guy and eventually looses the farm and more to the same guy.There is a law that allows you to seek shelter by whatever means reasonably necessary and I believe this is the law that allowed the man to sue. Not 100% clear on the details but you get the gist of it!
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++It's basis lies in English Common Law. Since the time before William the Bastard stole the Crown mantraps (i.e., the trip gun) have been illegal. Bear traps and deadfalls had to be clearly marked so a man would not fall into or set them off.A Malayan gate (stick under tension with spikes, set across a pathway or access) would have produced the same result as the trip gun.Leon
"I am shocked at how brazen some thieves are now days though"Tell me about it:http://tinyurl.com/5or6as"A Wal-Mart employee was seriously injured when three men and a woman ran out of the store with four stolen flat-screen TVs and assaulted the employee". We live in a small city (population 47K) and this kind of blatant stuff never happened even five years ago. I can only imagine what it's like to be a cop in a large city like LA.
The copper thieves hit me about 2 years ago. Cut the lines in from the pole and took a bunch of wire. Then nothing for two years. Probably the guy got caught and was in jail. Now he's out? And I'm on his shopping list. Every other week he comes back to find some more.
If he takes the glorified extension cord I now have in the conduit, I will have to come up with a thief resistant underground system. I'll try the concrete filled conduit for a rebuilt (bigger) conduit and some other "at risk" wire. Should I rebar reinforce the concrete as they seem to hit the conduit with a sledgehammer to get at the wire. Or is just the bagged post hole mix good enough?
Do I get in trouble if a rattlesnake happpens to get trapped in the conduit and bites the thief?
Eric
Do I get in trouble if a rattlesnake happpens to get trapped in the conduit and bites the thief?
As long as your finger prints are not on the snake at the time of the bite you're good!
Doug
Do I get in trouble if a rattlesnake happpens to get trapped in the conduit and bites the thief?
How about filling the conduit with poison ivy?
Just for the greater good .... There's often a lot of hormone-driven passion when the topic of crime comes up. There's also a lot of misinformation as to how things work. So, what's one to do? Well .... read! As Solomon said, there's nothing new under the sun. Probably the best book on the subject of the use of deadly force is "In The Gravest Extreme," by Masaad Ayoob. Don't let the name fool you ... this guy is 100% Connecticut Yankee, law enforcement professional, and allowed to practice law. He also -literally- wrote the training manual used by the US Navy in firearms training. As for crime in general, and understanding the criminal, his book "The Truth About Self-Protection" is an excellent start. Both titles are available from either the Police Bookshelf, or Backwoods Home magazine. Why they're not found at the local bookstore is a topic for the Woodshed.
That might work! A sign with "Warning poison ivy infestation"
Get some of that skunk odor that the highway dept puts on pine trees to keep people from cutting them, and fill the conduit with it. If they take it, they'll stink like skunk. May not stop them, but they'll stink like heck for a few days.If its on a farm, find the meanest orneriest? bull and pen him up where the wire is buried.
In a similar vain the dye packs that the banks put in money when their is a hodlup..
.
A-holes. Hey every group has to have one. And I have been elected to be the one. I should make that my tagline.
Heard this one on the radio told by Bruce Williams. He said that he was away on a business trip gets a call from one of the ladies at his office saying the AC was not working. He told her why are you calling me call the HVAC guy. Several hours later he gets her calling back saying the HVAC repair person is there and that the coils where missing from that unit and others on the roof. Low life's in the middle of the night got on the one story roof and stole the coils out of the self contained units. They were picky only taking the larger coils leaving the smaller ones in place. 1200 repair job for 30-100 scrape!Wallyo
I was thinking along those lines. See whether that dye can be mixed with the lube that you use in the conduit, and mix in a gallon of that skunk #### to boot!
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LOL.
Red Chaulk and Buck Lure..Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
"We strive for conversion,we get lost in conversation, and wallow in consternation. "Me.
Most times you cannot use deadly force to protect property ONLY, but there are numerous scenarios where you can protect property with deadly force.Not that I recommend most of them personally.
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
Thieves who stole an 8-foot statue of Jesus Christ
Wouldn't it be funny if all the religious dogma people like me think is nuts turns out to be true:
St. Peter: "Sorry boys, but the Big Guy is pretty unhappy you stole the statue of His Son. Off to Hades with you. Since He is merciful, you come up for parole in 100 trillion years. While you're there, say hello to Dick Cheney."
ENERGIZE IT!!!!!!!!!
Aluminum isn't safe either. A thief will take anything. Even cast iron storm drain covers. They even stole the fire hydrants in the new subdivision before they were tied into the city's water main.
I can give you no advice and if i did it would probably be worthless.
But i do feel your pain to bust your butt to work hard and have some numbskull steal from you.
Meth heads stole my tools, cops act like there put out they have to hear about it.
Guard spider.
What's the going price for scrap copper?
Maybe I should re-roof before I sell, new roof would sound good to buyers?
Joe H
2.75 per lb. in Statesville today. (for #2)
.55 for old sheet alum.
The best reward for a job well done is the opportunity to do another.
Edited 6/11/2008 8:11 pm ET by davidhawks
My recycler is paying 3.80 for #1 last week.Wallyo