As some of you may know I am no longer working for myself. I have been working for a commercial company for almost two years now. On the hospital I built I have seen a lot of good tradesmen and some not so good.
This guy takes the cake though.
The guy installing the x-ray machine (800 grand machine) cant even read a tape.
Really
I saw him counting the 1/8ths last week. Ok maybe he is used to metric or something I dont know. But today he calls me in there and says that I need to get my electrician to run him a 220 circuit for his machine.
“no problem, I say. does it need to be a critical circuit?”
He told me no it didnt have to be critical circuit but he needed the 220 on one wire.
No joke. Really. With all the skilled craftsmen out of work in Florida, why would you send these guys half way across the country to install that kinda stuff?
Why?
Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
Replies
Could it be a language problem? One wire may mean something different to him than to you, but it could be correct if he meant a dedicated circuit with a single supply. I would imagine that if he's an expert X-ray technician, he might be able to leave you well behind in his own jargon. Maybe you shouldn't be so quick to critique. My test: Do you say masonary or masonry? If the former, you haven't cause to be critical of others.
Could it be a language problem?
No I can promise that even though I am a Texan I speak Floridian very well. Spanish too somewhat.
No I asked this guy twice what he meant and he specifically said a 220 with only one wire to his machine. When I replied that it was impossible he told me they do it in Europe all the time.
Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
Bambam. Too bad you haven't been to europe.. over there 220 is normal household currant same way 110 is over here..
The thing to worry about is in europe the frequincy is 50 Hertz compared to our 60 hertz. So I suspect even if he gets it wired it will have serious problems..
So if the EU has 220 currant
& the US has only 110 currant
who can make more jelly?
Grandfather had a Victory Garden down at the end of the street by the RR tracks. He grew currants there, among a lot of other good things. We made jelly, stored it in shallow Ball jars with parafin covering it.
Delicious stuff, with butter on toast. Nothin' like homemade. No machine can put love in the jar.
Grandparents property in upstate NY had tons...and I mean tons, of wild blackberry and elderberry bushes, all the way down to the Susquahanna. As kids we ate them 'till they came out our ears. But the preserves were to die for.
Grandparents property in upstate NY had tons...and I mean tons, of wild blackberry and elderberry bushes, all the way down to the Susquahanna. As kids we ate them 'till they came out our ears. But the preserves were to die for.
Ah, lead me to the berry patch. I'll be pickin' and eatin' all day. It's the bear in me, I guess.
We have elderberries and blackberries in my part of NYS too. There's a fair patch of both kinds on my property. I like to pick a cupful in the morning and make pancakes with 'em. Once I surprised a black bear who was havin' his own breakfast. He ran, I stayed.
There's a farm a few miles away where they grow berries, raspberries mostly. They allow people to come in and pick their own for a fee. Local people make preserves with 'em. One small family restaurant makes raspberry preserves to put on their homemade sourdough bread and toast with breakfast. They also bake some pies with 'em. Amazing flavor, either way.
and that's why I read here - to keep up with currant events ;o)Jeff
From what I understand, theirs is 220 to ground as opposed to our household 220 (2- 110). That right?
You miss the point frenchy. it is impossible to wire for 220 with less than three wires, and a 'critical' circuit' must run through the emergency generator panel
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That's a given! However critical reading of the OP seems to indicate the there was a comunication problem and perhaps the person meant one wire as in Romex.
I don't know why some people get so hung up on Jargon.. I used to use a lot of jargon myself untill a very wise professor explained that I was using it as a defence mechanism to set myself apart from those not on the "inside"
When I was teaching those who helped me on my timberframe I didn't insist that they use tenion and mortice. If they choose to call it a stub and pocket that was fine as long as we were both understanding what was meant..
It seems that after a time they too started using the proper name for things as they gained confidence and no longer felt excluded..
It is not 'jargon'. It is very specific technical language necessary to do the job required.
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there was a comunication problem and perhaps the person meant one wire as in Romex.
Again, I can promise there was no communication problem. I asked twice what he meant. Besides, What difference would it make if it was romex or not?
Besides the fact that the Fire Marshal would take off his gun and shoot me with it if I had someone install it in a hospital.
No he specifically said he wanted a 220. When I asked what amp he said "I dont know".
I ahd to look at his specs and tell him what the amps were. The one wire part came after this conversation.
I had to get the electrician and him together so they could hook it up. they are supposed to turn it on Monday. We'll see how it goes.Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
Pif, But I did sand lots of floors with 2 wire 240. Halfway through my time there came down a rule that you had to use 3 wire. That cord was really awkward and heavy at first till you got used to it. All the 3rd wire did was ground the machine and made it harder to throw the cord around. However, it was good practice to avoid grounded radiators etc in case you had a shorted machine problem. Also, for the rare times that we would find a house that only had one wire 120 we got a transformer that would boost the 120 to 240. That made our flexible motors run much better. So if you're talking about an $800,000 machine it would be possible to hand him one wire with 240 volts in it. I don't know if that fellow would really know what to do with it though. LOL Mesic
"Also, for the rare times that we would find a house that only had one wire 120 we got a transformer that would boost the 120 to 240. That made our flexible motors run much better. So if you're talking about an $800,000 machine it would be possible to hand him one wire with 240 volts in it. I don't know if that fellow would really know what to do with it though."Plain and simple - THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A SINGLE WIRE THAT HAS 120 OR 240 OR ANY OTHER VOLTAGE ON IT.A voltage can only be measured between TWO points..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
Bill, OK smarty, But I could hand him one wire with 240 volts potential. LOL
Ahem,... in a 440V AC three-phase ciruit, isn't each phase 220VAC from the neutral? You can tap into that circuit (phase) and use it as 220VAC. It is the phase to phase difference that creates the 440V differential.
I could be wrong, it has been a long time since I did it, almost 30 years ago.
Edited 11/14/2009 4:00 am ET by Mike_Mills
It's easier to think about it in 120v 3 phase terms. In that case if you check across two of the three connections you would measure 208v. And so if you wanted regular 2 wire 240 you were coming up a little weak. In my post I mentioned that we had a transformer to boost regular 120v to 240v. That same transformer had a switch on it to boost the 208 back up to 240. That made a noticeable difference. Let me take a shot at explaining how I understand three phase. You have 3 wires. Each one measured to ground reads 120v. The phases have to pulse 60 times a second and so when one is at its high peak the other hasn't quite made it to its low peak as in two wire 240v where each wire is exactly 180º out of phase and thus your meter reads 240v across two 120v, out of phase, connections. And so your meter on a 3 phase system, when trying for 240v will only read 208v. Hope it helps and I hope I didn't mess up Mesic
Thanks, mesic, I understand 3 phase AC power.
163 VAC peak = 115V rms, got it.
Phase-to-phase; phase-to neutral; phase-to-ground; neutral-to-ground - check!
Has anyone figured out what the guy was after when he asked is half-baked question?
Without all the information, I can't answer 100% sure ... but it looks like the equipment requires an isolation transformer, even if it were being installed in Europe.
With a transformer invloved, it's very possible to create a system with one 'hot' and a neutral.
Also: Important detail here ... the equipment is most likely designed for 230v (not 220), and that has to be within 5% (US specs are 10%)
This is beyond the experience of most electricians, and it's definitly not a good tome for OJT.
Running a current with only one wire connection is not possible. You must mean something different than what you are saying
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Past my bedtime but why do you say I can't hand that guy a single hot wire? That's all he asked except in his case I guess he asked for 220v. A little harder but not impossible. Maybe not too practicle either but we don't know the whole circumstance. If that fancy machine is grounded, and chances are it is, he's got juice. Maybe somethings should be taken for granted, like he didn't say an insulated wire, but we probably wouldn't hand him a 220v hot bare wire. <G> Mesic Ye olde sac is lookin' pretty good
A voltmeter has two test probes on it.If you have only ONE wire to connect on probe to where do you connect the 2nd probe to make a measurement.Here is another example.Ultra high voltage transmission lines are sometimes serviced from a bucket suspended from a helicopter.The first think that they do is connect a wire from the bucket to the line.The line might be hundreds of thousands of volts with respect to ground. But to the person working on the line there is only ONE wire and they are completely safe..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
"Ultra high voltage transmission lines are sometimes serviced from a bucket suspended from a helicopter."
Video
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
Stick with peddling.First of all the European standard is 230 and the US is 120. Not 220 and 110.BUT THERE WIRING SYSTEM STILL REQUIRES TWO WIRES AS MINIMUM."The thing to worry about is in europe the frequincy is 50 Hertz compared to our 60 hertz. So I suspect even if he gets it wired it will have serious problems.."WRONG.Most problems are minor, IF THERE ARE ANY AT ALL. More and more systems don't care.And will possible there was a screw up, most likely if an expensive medical system can from Europe that it would already be setup for the appropriate voltage and frequency. IF NEEDED.
.
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
Is Masonary like sewerage?
I don't know what to tell you. I've seen it myself. 20 year union carpenter once saw me with a coping saw doing out crown joints and commented that he always wondered what those saws were for.
yeah, Ive seen them kind too.Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
i know this,before i give him 1 wire w 220,someones going to have to put it in writing with drawings.
blow up a 800k machine,i want someone elses neck on the line.
3 phase with the 2 120v left unhooked?????????the older i get ,
the more people tick me off
someones going to have to put it in writing with drawings.
Yeah, I can see the engineer signing off on that on all right lol.Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
20 year union carpenter once saw me with a coping saw doing out crown joints and commented that he always wondered what those saws were for.
I still wonder what they are for I use a jig saw or grinder. :)
>I still wonder what they are for I use a jig saw or grinder. :)<Well, I have three, just in case.
Usually in the middle of the day, or it could be at the end of the day, when the firebox has the steam up to full pressure and I'm getting low on water, when the customer is starting to say "By the way while you're here...", when the DW call in tears and tells me that Karen B. is in stage three, when it's Friday around 4:00 pm and that last piece of walnut that was left for the mantel got cut 1" too short because I burned that fu@&!ng inch and I have to get paid because the people are going to Fiji for two weeks at 6:00, when the ADD has me tangled in a fit of St. Vitus Dance...That's when I go out to my truck and reach in the back for that little saw with the blade taught & straight under its own tension from built in opposing forces, and yet able to turn even the tightest corners and go in other directions, or even be reversed when you get tired of pushing and you want to pull. I hold it and marvel at the simplicity.
Then I feel better.That's what I use a coping saw for. It helps me cope.
View Image
They cut copper too.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
I worked for a medical company and was installing a pierce of equipment in an Cath lab (X-ray type room for inserting catheters in arteries).
The room was finished and painted, all the major equipment installed and the cabinetry in. They were filling the drawers and cabinets when one of the technicians started looking for an outlet to plug some of the accessories in. None to be found in the whole room. There were no outlets on the plans. Through the whole construction process, all the trades and equipment installers just ran extension cords out into the hall. Apparently nobody mentioned the lack of outlets. Very expensive change order to put outlets into lead lined walls with all the cabinets already installed. I wonder if the guy who drew the plans still has a job?
I wonder if the guy who drew the plans still has a job?
Probably
Our engineer wanted us to put two 44" doors in an 88 1/4" hallway. He didnt understand why it couldnt be done.
worked for a medical company and was installing a pierce of equipment in an Cath lab (X-ray type room for inserting catheters in arteries).
We have two cath labs and are pricing a third one now. The third one will have robotics built in also. In one room its supposed to be the first of its kind in the US. Toshiba makes it. Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
BamBam
Two 44 inch doors? No big deal! I'm currantly building two 45 inch doors for the boat house entrance in the basement. Black walnut and hard maple.. right now there is double pane glass but there will soon be a stained glass in there..
Frenchy, I think Bambam was saying that two 44" doors would not fit into a hallway that was only 88 1/4" wide, not that they couldn't be made.
I was thinking the engineer wanted to close off the 88 1/4 inch hallway. But if he was saying the hallway was only 88 1/4 inches long then you're right..
Yes , all the hallways are 8' except where the lobbies intersect then they narrow down to 88 1/4". Every door in the hallways are dbl 44" except the ones I did as an as built in these lobbies at 40". The engineer didnt take into consideration the janb widths.
But I had to argue the point with him first because he is ALWAYS right. lolPolitical correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
was it a little like explaining it to frenchy?
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LMAO
No it was a little worse.Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
Funny reminder.
Dad was a calibration and test technician for Moog, making servocontrols, actuators, and gauges for Lockheed and others that went into Apollo and some fighter aircraft. He did this for twenty some years, then retired to FL.
That was in the era of Carter's inflation and Dad soon learned that his standard of living would not be acceptable any more, even with lower cost of living in that state, so he went looking for work again. Got hired onto a solar heat company ( there were dozens of them springing up that year) with a job description of sales. His intro to the CO gave him lessons in HVAC engineering, which was veryu compatible with his prior experiences, except that he was used to far more stringent accurancy.
Then they sent him into the field to do installations!
He had never learned to read a tape and the guy supervising him thought he was an absolute dummy. Needless to say, they did not6 get along, Dad told him to F*** off and he then had to find a new job, never comprehending why this company would hire him with his qualifications,then try to use him for what was basically carpenters helper menial stuff.
Welcome to the
Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
Then they sent him into the field to do installations!
I did cut him some slack on the tape part but there is more to this than just the OP. My crew and I had to actually help him set the machine because he was unsure how.
OTOH.
I got a job once for a framer one time and hired on as a carp. Lead carp in 30 days if panned out.
I put the saw blade in backwards.
Good first impression huh? I did get the job though after I got over mt nervousness and went to work.Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
When I was building Ken Smith Bass's, we hired a guy that was a machinest from Alabama, worked at Huntsville, making Space Shuttle parts.
He came in the first day boasting 'I worked for NASA, we worked to a thousanth of an inch tolerance"
I just looked over and said, " We build giutars, we get it right on"...LOLSpheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations
Through the years i have worked with many people that could not read a tape, I think some people cant adjust there eyes to see the numbers and fractions.. No body ever lost there job if they were with me and a good sort. I always taught people to just read the big and little ones and forget the small ones. If i was getting numbers i just told them say heavy or light after the little ones {one eighth}. my best helpers sometimes never read a tape. The guy down the street has a son that lost job after job cause he was dyslexics. I did all the figuring and measuring, Granted it was mainly Sheathing. He was such a hard worker and the roofers loved him and said he was the best helper they ever had. The Dad thanks me when i see him for giving his son the confidence he needed. Ok he never will be a Carpenter but still a great guy to have around. I bet your dad was having trouble with his eyesight and did not want to admit it.. Like me!!!LOL
Jeff buck wants to ask you something, He asked me to send his email to ya. [email protected].
done
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Still may have been a language thing. clocalisms... (sp?) I have no idea of trade lingo in Europe though. A few antidotes though. A British lady once asked me if I could be there at "mid-day" to do some service work. I said "sure" thinking I like scheduling that doesn't involve being there at an exact time. :-) Once I did get there I was told "You said you would be here at 12:00 o'clock"...
I once did a little home improvement for an Indian guy (from India). He wanted to help. While there I taught him how to read a tape measure. The guy is a high level computer programmer at a company called SAS institute where my wife happens to work. You gotta figure this guy was pretty smart - just had a different skill set. Do they use metric in India or what?
Off topic but occasionally I see these Indian people trying to assimilate - which I guess is a good thing. Indian guy owns a small convenience store down the street. His 'name' is AJ and drives a pick-up. Always keeps the store TV on the sports channel. OTOH the other day I went to the drugstore. The lady working there who spoke perfect English was wearing a name tag. Her name was "Sh!tal". I nearly laughed in her face....
Helping at Habitat for Humanity I worked with a lady PE. She didn't know how to read a level. I taught her. Again - different skill set.
Edited 11/13/2009 8:07 am ET by Matt
Two amusing language stories:
The retired English lady next door when I was a kid told the story of when she first came to Canada, and upon checking in to the hotel, asked the front desk clerk to 'knock her up at 7am'....
And a Malaysian classmate of mine at university once got exasperated with being put down by his room mate, and finally shouted out, 'You think I know f nothing, I tell you, I know f ALL!!!'
Maybe this was the guy from the "frogger" episode of Seinfled. He was the electrician in this episode. He did not understand the term "outlet", he just called them "the holes". Funny stuff.
"Preach the Gospel at all times; if necessary, use words." - St. Francis of Assisi
No, I didn't vote for him; but he IS my president. I pray for the his safety, and the safety of his family every day. And I pray that he makes wise decisions.
The guy was right - in Europe they have 220 on the 'hot' and a neutral; here both wires are hot.
I'm sure he had never worked with a 'English" measure before, either. H really needs to sit down with a local, real electrician - and bring the manuals for the gear.
The sparky also needs to know Euro color codes .... If there is ANY doubt, have the sparky contact me (RenoSteinke at Yahoo) and I'll put him in touch with some truly, exceptionally qualified guys. I have sparky friends in Ireland, France, and Austria, among other places.
"in Europe they have 220 on the 'hot' and a neutral"so let's count....
hot = one
neutral = another onetotal twoSo it is not on one wire
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You can substitute your body for one wire.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
LOL
When I read the original post, I assumed the guy meant that he needed 220 on a 2-wire (plus ground, of course) instead of 3-wire. Is it possible he really thought a single conductor would carry voltage?
LOL
When I read the original post, I assumed the guy meant that he needed 220 on a 2-wire (plus ground, of course) instead of 3-wire. Is it possible he really thought a single conductor would carry voltage?
Yes, seriously he did.
Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
>> You can substitute your body for one wire. << That's what I was thinking.
All: ever grab ahold of a spark plug wire when the engine was either running or being cranked? One wire can dang near make you dirty your drawers. I'm sure Frenchy could handle it just fine and - and cheaper too... Jesheees... salesmen...
Matt, Sorry to delude you.. High voltage will bring me to my knees the same as anyone else.. The only possible differance is that I've done it enough that I am well aware of how nasty it is and avoid tha possiblity like the plague..
ps if you really want a shock grab a hold of a Vertex magneto. Mere battery ignition is tiny by comparison..
Parse it all you want ... I suspect a language issue as well.
That's why I offered to get involved.
Languages are amazing things ..... let's just say you can't really translate between them, you can only attempt to re-express the thought.
Look at it this way, you now know your potential for moving up have increased by at least one person.
Edited 11/14/2009 5:37 pm by woodway
Look at it this way, you now know your potential for moving up have increased by at least one person.
Now thats funny right there.
And true
Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
As they say - it takes all kinds.
This attitude obviously isn't limited to any one trade.
I once worked for a GC that employed his two sons on the crew. One was somewhat competent, but the other was a complete waste of oxygen.
Because he was the owner's son, of course, he always insisted on doing the "technical jobs" and relegated us to doing what he called the "grunt work". One day, as he was doing the cutting for some second story window replacements, (big mistake, I know), I called down for a measurement like "29 and 3/4". He threw up a board and I set it in place and it was too short (about 3/8"). I hollered down that it was too short, to re-cut and send up another one. Number two was almost exactly the same size. A little more exasperated tone, and I called down for a third board. Nearly the exact same size!
I hollered down, "Yo Rick - what the hell are you doing man? You do know that 3/4 is bigger than 3/8, don't you?" He hollered back up with a tone like he would use to talk to a complete idiot, "Yeah, right." I finally had to go down and show him how to read a tape. As I asked him to tell me what each stroke mark meant, he truly had no idea once we got past 1/4"!!
Oh I almost forgot, he once insisted he be the layout man when we were getting ready to set walls on a long, narrow veterinarian's office. We were sort of working with our heads down to make as much progress as possible. When we finally took a break, and one of the guys went for some sodas, he came back across the street and said, "this is the damndest building I've ever seen - it doesn't have any doors in it!" The owner's genius son had laid out the walls without checking which ones had the doors, and since we were sort of in "production mode", we'd just followed his layouts. As he was trying to tear out some joists with a sledgehammer, his Dad pulled up!
The person who says it
can't be done should not interrupt the person doing it. - CHINESE
PROVERB
This attitude obviously isn't limited to any one trade.
This guy isnt even our sub its the hospitals but we have to tie it in. Even in the company I work for it happens.
They hired a super off the street to finish a little build out next door to me. He asked me if he could borrow a helper to hang doors. The helper came back shaking his head and told me he had to show him how to put hinges in an already mortised door. (already pre=drilled too) The guy didnt even know how to read a hardware schedule. He showed him that too.
He was a nice guy but he lied on his resume. Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
If the hospital hired him there could be all sorts of things involved that we simply aren't aware of nor will we ever likely know the whole story. It may be a political in thing, Son of a important doctor, relative of the board a patient looking for compensation for a botched medical procedure.. a nervious board who want their own man involved because they fear tradesmen, etc..
"As he was trying to tear out some joists with a sledgehammer"
Is that for irony?
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
Who knows. We watched from a distance (sort of a silent pantomime) as his Dad called him over. He stood there with his head down, as his Dad was obviously on his case, and all he could to was shake his head side-to-side, then up-and-down, then side-to-side again, etc.
This discussion is starting to bring back old memories. We were once having an impromptu status get-together up on the second floor joists of a building we were doing. This same guy was being such a pain that another carpenter told him to help speed things up, he needed to, "go downstairs and count the nails in the sheathing on the first floor, so we'll know how many we need for the second floor." We all thought he would say something like "get outta here", but instead he went downstairs for about 5 minutes! He came back up, and we all thought, "Maybe he's catching on," but instead, he said, "You #### guys - - - I don't need to count those nails. I'll just get my old man to buy a whole box!"
The person who says it
can't be done should not interrupt the person doing it. - CHINESE
PROVERB
I guess you could have 220 on one wire if you took the center tap out of your transformer. Or upped the voltage via transformer. Maybe they do that for his machine.
Sewerage is an archaic term for systems to handle sewage. It was also applied to the study of the design, construction and operation of such systems.
Back when I was running survey crews, I had a kid on the crew who wasn't brite enough to hold his plumb bob on the zero on the metal tape.
We wasted two whole crew days trying to close to within 0.01-ft per 100-ft, because where he was holding was 0.1-ft away from the zero.
It was my fault though in a way, because it didn't occur to me that you would have to teach someone to hold on the zero.
Just like it never occured to me that the other guy I had on the crew, (who had done two tours in the Coast Guard), wouldn't know where east was, at seven in the moring with the sun still on the horizon. Same guy also couldn't multiply 6 X 1.2, even though he did know that 6 X 12 = 72. He got really pissed when I told him that if I were his Dad, I'd go down to the diocese office, and demand a refund of the tuition from the twelve years of Catholic school.
If you have the potential to ground, all you need is one conductor. Electric fences work that way.
But we are not talking eelectric fences or any of the other wild scenarios brought forward.We are talking a 220 connection in an American Commercial project.
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Bill, I realize a bird can set on a hot wire without harm.
I think that that wire with the high voltage on it is hot whether you measure it or not. If the guy from the copter bucket dropprd a line to near the ground and Joe Bloe came along and touched it he would have said it was hot, if he had time.<G>
The thing about high voltage is, you don't have to touch it. You just get too close and it reaches out and grabs YOU.
Is masonary when a concrete guy gets married?
Nope, a masonary is a religious person who builds stuff out of bricks in a foreign country. ;-)
-- J.S.
Oh, well that makes it all right then lol.
Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
Lot of things happen that aren't right.. I wasn't making a judgement on the subject. Simply explaining what might have happened.
Lot of things happen that aren't right.. I wasn't making a judgement on the subject. Simply explaining what might have happened.
You got it all wrong Frenchy. You could be right I was just making fun of the possible truth of it.
I have seen to many that got hired because they can talk a good game. I have always had to prove myself because I dont brag enough I guess.Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end,
That's certainly valid.. I've known a lot of salesmanagers who achieved that position because they couldn't sell so they thought it would be easier to tell people how to sell. Surprisingly good salesmen make lousy managers and visa versa..
(I'm a firm believer in the peter principle)
Another way to look at it:
Draw a triangle with three equal sides. Then draw lines from the center of that triangle to each corner. Now you have three angles of 120 degrees each in the middle. If you compare the ratio of the distance from the center to a corner with the length of a side, it's the same as the voltages, 120:208. If you draw it up with metric measurements, it'll fit on an ordinary piece of paper. 208mm is a little over 8".
-- J.S.
My friends in Austria and Belgium have 240 volts to ground, and they get three phase at home. There's no single phase over there. Electric motors there are more cost effective, and run quieter. No starting windings, capacitors, etc.
-- J.S.
Masonary or masonry, wait a minute while I consult my realator. :)
What's your point? European household 220V wiring still uses two wires.