I’ve just about completed renovating the exterior of an investment property. I changed the architectural style from ugly “Brady Bunch era” to a classic traditional style. Lap siding, double hung windows with grilles and etc.
We have rough framed the front porch with a gabled roof covering it, and now all I need to do is install the decking on my front porch. I am planning on painting the surface and I am looking for something that will be a fairly hard surface, but not cost an arm and a leg. I live in Colorado and the area below the porch is open and breathes easily. There will be no moisture problems.
If I’m going for the traditional look, what kind of lumber would I use? What species, Doug Fir? What kind of joint, T&G?
Looking for opinions.
I have already used the search function and have not been able to find this question addressed.
Thanks,
Edited 11/11/2002 2:50:07 PM ET by MIWUK
Edited 11/11/2002 6:52:59 PM ET by MIWUK
Replies
Traditional here in the east is to use fir T&G and paint it with a grey deck paint. Open decks use Fir CVG square edged spaced to allow drainage and sealed with clear sealer or oil
Excellence is its own reward!
"The first rule is to keep an untroubled spirit. The second is to look things in the face and know them for what they are." --Marcus Aurelius
Thanks Piffin, good info.
Edited 11/11/2002 6:52:03 PM ET by MIWUK
Edited 11/11/2002 6:54:11 PM ET by MIWUK
and I am looking for something that will be a fairly hard surface, but not cost an arm and a leg
I understand what you're saying but think you're shooting yourself in the foot if you don't look for high quality at the outset. Despite what we'd love to see at the paint store, no finish is bulletproof, and even the best paints and deck stains wear through with foot traffic. Is it better to have one that lasts as long as possible, or save a little $ and have to re-do it every couple of years? Don't fault you at all for the sentiment. $40 a gallon anything makes me head hurt. I think I'd talk to the paint store of your choice (or any friends who have been painting for years) and look at the characteristics of what's available for your application. I'm a big SW fan, and I know some of their industrial floor enamels are seriously sturdy, but I don't know that they're intended for outdoor use. I'd spend the dough for something that will last as much as possible and not have me out there scraping and sanding and repainting a few years down the road.
I agree that tongue and groove is the only way to go.
I recently used some Jotoba (aka Brazilian Cherry) on a covered porch. It was about $4.00 a square foot, which was about the same as fir (which has really gotten spendy these days). The porch hasn't been in long enough for me to tell you personally how the species will hold up long term. However, it looks great so far. At any rate, with the price of fir being what it is now, I'd consider using some sort of hardwood.
A local suplier is starting to carry Ipe in a tongue and groove format. Ipe enjoys a great reputation for durability. However, if you use it in T&G, make sure it's not green and wet, or you could end up with problems.
Good luck on your project.
Ragnar
Around here (southern tier NY) we us Monogamy T&Gon our porch floors.
Remember to back prime!
Mr TDo not try this at home!
I am a trained professional!
Mr T
The question is what to USE for the floor, not WHAT IS BEING DONE ON the floor.
"Around here (southern tier NY) we us Monogamy T&Gon our porch floors."
BTW, this is a family forum. I don't want to know what you are doing on your floor <G>.
Edited 11/12/2002 2:02:52 PM ET by Bill Hartmann
We can get Monogamy pretty readily around here.
But I here it is harder to get in Utah!!!
Maybe because they don't believe in tongue and groove?
TDo not try this at home!
I am a trained professional!
DO try that at home.
In Utah, do they use high gloss polygamy or satin?.
Excellence is its own reward!
"The first rule is to keep an untroubled spirit. The second is to look things in the face and know them for what they are." --Marcus Aurelius
Whatever type of wood you settle on be sure to also consider winter traction. A painted or varnished floor will turn into a skating rink if you don't. Adhesive strips or a sand-like paint additive are the only solutions I know about but maybe there are others.
Those are all good points, thanks.
But I am kind of confused now. I called my contact at my local lumber yard, and he told me that he would not recommend using T&G here in Colorado because he is stating that since the humidity is so low out here, when it does rain, the wood will swell and may cause problems with twisting & etc. Plus, he is stating that even though the porch is covered, water will still get in during storms with winds, and it will seep to the underneath side of the T&G where the wood is not painted. I asked him if back priming would cure this and he still seemed leery. I am planning on calling a paint store today to ask an expert.
Has anyone here installed a clear semi gloss or satin finish on a front porch deck? Reason I ask, is that my contact is recommending that I install Ironwood, and we would probably not want to paint that. I heard from a friend that on some of the jobs that he has been working on lately, that the front porches have a satin or semi gloss clear finish on them. And he is stating that they look very nice, but I do not know what species or joint they have used on those projects.
Thanks for all of the feedback.
The Ironwoods is the Ipe' or pay Lope' mentioned above. It is definitely better than fir but you asked for traditional which is why I mentioned the fir. For my money it would be Ipe' Ironwoods and it doesn't need a finish but Penefin is good for it if you want a finish. You'll have to pre-drill for every fastener with ironwood.
You other concerns from the supplier about t&G have some validity which is why every one above mentioned backpriming it to prevent both rot and the cupping. Supliers concerns aside,this is the traditional way to take care of it. If you go with fir (by the way search the archives as we've discussed these details ad naseum here) it is in the grooves that rot first gets started but I've seen twenty year old porch decks that had been covered with a roof and maintained wioth regular painting that werre barely showing their age. .
Excellence is its own reward!
"The first rule is to keep an untroubled spirit. The second is to look things in the face and know them for what they are." --Marcus Aurelius
Piffin, you are right, I did another search and found a lot of info. I found one thread where a user recommended Tendura. That stuff looks promising. I just sent them an e-mail requesting a sample. I think I may like that stuff.
tendura.com
I can not use Ironwood because it is to dark of a species for my application. It's appearance would clash with my scheme.
Thanks to all on this thread.
Edited 11/13/2002 10:03:14 AM ET by MIWUK
Ipe will season to a nice silvery-gray color. Not sure if that fits the aesthetic or not. Just let it go au natural, or (preferred) use Seasonite instead of Penofin.
O.K. Mongo, that is something to think about. I thought it would stay a dark brown. I have never used it before as you can tell.
Thanks,
It's the UV of the sun that silvers it so if covered and shaded it might take a while to silver out..
Excellence is its own reward!
"The first rule is to keep an untroubled spirit. The second is to look things in the face and know them for what they are." --Marcus Aurelius
I agree with Piffin's suggestion to use Penofin -- I've used it too, and it seems to be a great product.
Using T&G is the traditional approach on porch floors. One other thing to remember (in case someone hasn't said it already): the traditional method is to lay the T&G flooring directly over the joists. That is, NO subfloor. That way, when water finds its way between the T&G, it can air out on the bottom side as opposed to being trapped are thereby encouraging rot.
Ragnar
Colorado?
With the winters, the summers, the elevation, and the UV, I'd recommend Ipe with Penofin.
I'll be out in Eagle this June putting down 4100 sq feet for the stuff. See you there!
You're starting too soon. it'll be hard to stretch the job out 'till skiing season.
LOL.
Excellence is its own reward!
"The first rule is to keep an untroubled spirit. The second is to look things in the face and know them for what they are." --Marcus Aurelius
Actually...I'm late!
My wife and son flew out there last week. I'm home with my daughter. A bit of fun today, though...a history field trip to MA to see the Mayflower and Plimoth Plantation. Good timing, we got out of 1627 just as the cold rain started to fall.
I see lots of 60-70 year-old porches in these parts with the original fir or SYP T&G flooring intact. The longevity of the flooring seems to be largely determined by the following:
1. Is the drip line well outside the edge of the porch (12"-16")?
2. Is the porch framed so that the flooring runs perpendicular to the house and has a drop of around 1/4" in 1' (no standing water after a rain storm)?
3. Was the flooring laid wet (painting as you go, sealing tongue and grove plus underside to moisture)?
4. Was the endgrain either left exposed (so that it would dry quickly) or well protected?
5. Was the area under the porch well ventilated?
If all this is done, fir and SYP will likely last a good long time, even given the quality of the new material.
If not, consider whether you want to use Ipe or other exotic or take a chance on a composite T&G flooring like Tendura.