Hey Guys, I know I’ll need to get a spec on this from the archy, but for now I need some advice on what gauge metal stud to use for a demising wall 23 feet tall.
It’s going to have 2 layers 5/8 type x on each side.
Right now it’s spec’d with 2×6 16 OC with solid blocking at 8 foot centers, but I’d really like to build it with steel.
What do you think?
Rich
Replies
I would prefer to build it with steel studs also.
"...craftsmanship is first & foremost an expression of the human spirit." - P. Korn
bakersfieldremodel.com
Right? 24 foot 2x6 are gonna be pretty wacky!
On my other computer I believe I still have a light-gauge steel framing guide downloaded from U.S. Steel. Might wanna google for it and see if it's still available.
I'll try that, tried calling marinoware today, but the techhie was out.
http://www.dietrichindustries.com/
peruse this site, they might have some information or be forthcoming with some if you make contact.
What will this bottom out on? A roof with movement would require deep slip track up top.
cold rolled cross bars through the stud holes probably a necessity also.
When working high we used an extended platform scissorlift.
(with one side of the guard rails removed to place the board, a shorter guardrail held the board till placed)A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
What would the cold rolled bar be for, and how would it be attached?
They would be used for horizontal bracing. What I am used to is a u-shaped bar that you slip into the knockouts in the studs-sliding it through consecutive studs and locking them together. Bar is maybe 14' long, you lap over when placing another bar. This bracing improves deflection of an individual stud by tieing the wall studs together.
After sliding the bar through a series of studs, you turn it down and it locks into the square opening in the keyhole shaped knockouts. Overlaps are run long and tie wired together.
But in looking at Dietrichs site-Bracing- I see they have bracing that carries layout right along with it. Now there would be a product worth investigating, especially on such a tall wall. Check out to the backer clips for wood blocking.
A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
http://www.quittintime.com/
looks like regular black iron, the channel used to support hung ceilings, yes?
That type of bracing is not called for if both sides of the wall are sheathed with rock or other material. It is in Deitrichs specs, along with the other manufacturers. Mike
Small wheel turn by the fire and rod, big wheel turn by the grace of god.
Yeah. Tracks in place, work the studs in one at a time. Gonna need some scaffolding for hanging rock on that one! Double 5/8" each side, wow, that's what, a 2-hr. firewall?"...craftsmanship is first & foremost an expression of the human spirit." - P. Korn
bakersfieldremodel.com
Yeah , 2 hr. wall, lotta material in that one. 180 Lf too...
Rich,
Here's a link to Deitrich's sizing calculator. You'll need some values for lateral load and deflection in addition to height/spacing and wallboard thickness, but other than that pretty straightforward.
http://www.dietrichindustries.com/ddg/membersizing.asp
Seems that we'll only get 5 PSF or so for the lateral load. Even with 20 gauge.
We use 20 ga. 3-5/8" w/ 1-1/4" flange up to 24' quite a lot.
20 ga. 6" studs would be fine. Use 1-5/8" flange for a more stout wall and easier screwing. These are commonly called exterior or stucco studs.
Tallest walls I have built personally were 56' 10" studs @ a Lockheed job. Was on a job where they ponied two 60' studs to make a 120' wall, also at Lockheed in a missle assembly plant.
Mike
Small wheel turn by the fire and rod, big wheel turn by the grace of god.
Edited 2/17/2009 12:04 am by ruffmike
Thats the info I need right there. Thanks
Holy XXXX !!!120 foot wall????
Just remember when hanging the first two rows of rock to mark the layout on the sheets and pull the studs straight. You don't need any black iron stiffeners if both sides get rock.
Here is a shot of a job we are finishing this month. Going to try and do a photo thread of our next project, over a thousand feet of mansard roof out of steel studs. Mike
Small wheel turn by the fire and rod, big wheel turn by the grace of god.
Hey, I've seen that pic before..... is most of your work commercial?
Yes, almost exclusively commercial. Still work on houses for some friends. The last two companies I've been with do high end residential, but I am rarely involved.
Are you dividing up a large building? We call them dimising walls out here, usually done to subdivide commercial tilt-ups. Mike
Small wheel turn by the fire and rod, big wheel turn by the grace of god.
Yes , new demising wall. Existing tenant is downsizing, so they are dividing up the space.
Seems like commercial is the only work around here. Usually pays better anyway.
Just a thought.
Use LSLs. Perfectley straight and they come in 32 foot lengths and are fairly stiff.
I imagine they'd be really expensive,no?
They ain't cheap, but are real easy to work with
As a guess, the real issue will be in what guage your galvanized supplier has 24 foorters in stock in. Probably going to be 20 or 22ga, like as not.
I'd probably spec 1.5" cold-rolled channel stiffeners three vertically in the wall height no more than 48" OC.
if this is a load-bearing wall, I'd spend the cash to get a PE to sign off the swap, especially since might need stiffer than 28ga channel top & bottom.
Since this is demising wall, I'm guessiing you have acess to both sides. This is a good thing. I've had to use elevator shaft board to achieve three-hour walls I've only had one side access to--this is under-fun at the best of times.
Bid set right now, archy will spec. when the construction doc's are done.
when the construction doc's are done
Ah, gotcha. You might want to suggest to them to ask the building owner if that worthy wants to pay for rated raceway (probably not) or for some oversize emt (possibly) set in place for the future tenannt's electrical needs before you cover up that wall.
I've been the guy having to explain how much more the TI work is going to cost after the electricians get that rated wall wired up. Which redoubles with telco and now networking cable runs. Makes for a lot of drywall work after trenching through two laters of X board, which you have to do in a step, to get a good lap to use the fire pookie on. Makes installing some blanked boxes on 1" or 1.25' emt a lot cheaper, which means "more rentable" to the owner.
I've been to this game from three of the four sides, so I have some biases. Even have a couple of cents to show for any of it, too <sigh>.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
Yeah, good idea, the landlord says that he has a tenant for the other space.
I'd sure want steel also... you might check to see if you can get your fire rating by hang'n the rock on one side and then getting the stud bays sprayed with fire proofing... sprayed in like wet cellulose... then hand the other side... cuts your drywall usage in half... cost wise you'll save on labor... but i think material is a wash...
I know it can be done and UL has a spec for it... maybe the fireproof installer can help... it will also soundproof the wall...
P
They're looking for both sides finished. Never heard of doing it that way to get 2 hrs. though.
you still have to finish both sides... you just hand one side... fill the stud bays with fireproofing then hang the other side... you have 1hr worth of drywall 5/8 on each side... you jusy have another 1hr between em.... just like get'n a 1hr on structural steel.. they spray it... same spray
p