this is kinds OT, but why do so many of you detest Dewalt. Their tools can’t be that bad in regards to quality. I see alot of maintenance and trades use the big yellow. My neighbor has their table saw and I’ve used it a couple times with no complaint.
Is it their marketing that makes you guys sick? They HD borg like syndrome that has taken over B&D, Emglow, etc.
Just curious.
Replies
I have had 3 DW tools ( trim router, RO sander, corded drill) for several years; they all seem fairly well put together and I've never had one quit on me. But each one has some little niggling thing about it that makes me think the engineers didn't spend enough time in developing it. Either the switch can't make up its mind whether it wants to be on or off, the keyless drill chuck is too small and too slippery to tighten securely, or (here's my main gripe) the insulation on the power cords rot away after six months. Actually six months is an exaggeration, its more like just after a year when the warranty is up. GP
I'm just posting to second gp's remarks. Nearly everytime I ask a guy how he likes his Dewalt (insert any tool here) he always says "I love it. The trigger sticks," (or, "-it wont stay in reverse," or "-the table's half a degree off...", etc.) but other than that, it's great."
You don't hear those qualifications with a lot of other tools.
I have worked in a few large shops where the power tools were provided, which of course means they were mercilessly punished. I have never seen Dewalt tools in those shops. They just can't stand up to constant "Hey, I didn't pay for it..." abuse.
My two cents.
Don
they're just jealous!
same dude's that get pissed off when ya roll up with a van load of nice tools and they got a rusty circular saw in the bed of the pick up......somehow it's suddenly all your fault! Jeff She's exotic ,but not foreign, like an old Cadillac......she's a knockout!
I have a couple of their 18volt cordless drill and I love them. I abuse tools mercilessly and those two drills have held up great for a few years now. I also have a few 5" random orbital variable speed sanders and they're great...except I have to replace the variable speed control about once a year. I think that's because of the dusty conditions and delicacy of that switch, but other than that, I love those sanders, too.
Had a biscuit joiner that I recently sold because I just didn't use it much, but that was a good tool, too. DeWalt's fine in my book. Nothing special.Brinkmann for president in '04
I really dont have a problem with their tools its there customer service I dont especially care for. A example, I went to a woodworking show about 4 years ago and I seen the dewalt reps there. I told him that my boy dropped my countersink and I needed a new drill for it. The dewalt rep told me to go to a service center they sold them there. Ok I thought so I was walking around some more and saw a Makita rep give a guy a 9v battery for his drill and said " Merry Xmas" I thought wow dewalt sure is cheap. Then I told the makita rep the story of what the dewalt rep said and he told me" Hey customer service is whats its all about" Then he said he was out of countersinks and to remind him at the next show he'd take care of me . Well i seen him at the next show he gave a complete countersink set with reg drill and tips. I think it was going for about 25 bucks in the stores. Not that im out for freebies but
The indicators are there. I went to a dewalt store to get a pad for my ROS and I ordered it . I told the guy behind the counter that the body of it was moving. He told me to bring it in and if its a minor repair no prob. So when the pad came in I brought the ROS with me . When I told a different person behind the counter the problem they told me I would have to pay for the repair, when I told them what the previous guy said (I noticed the repairman ran rather quickly into the backroom) . So anyway I fixed it myself and swore off dewalt from that moment on. Like the makita rep said "Customer Service is what its all about" Darkworksite4: When the job is to small for everyone else, Its just about right for me"
Lets see, here are my little experiences.
I have a corded and cordless Dewalt drill. In their years, these things have travelled farther towards the ground than I have along the ground. I think they are great and the triggers have never stuck. I bought the corded unit 6 years ago because it was cheap and I didn't want to burn out my fancy Makita with a paddle mixer. The Dewalt outlasted it despite the high torque/low speed abuse. I give them two votes.
I have a Dewalt 5 inch grinder. It has worked well through light duty use. I'm not sure how you can screw up a grinder, so there is half a vote.
That said, I bought one of their circular saws on sale a couple months back and it stinks. I think the power is OK but the base is out over 1/8 of an inch. I haven't sent it in for repair/adjustment yet, but I intend to soon. I'll let you know what their service is like. Besides the base, I think the balance stinks and for a sidewinder, it weighs almost as much as a wormdrive. I should have been wiser before buying, so this is just a vote against me.
I just bought a Dewalt planer this week. So far I have only had time to unpack it and check it for spec. I was going to buy the Makita. Both were on sale at a good price and when I compared a few details I liked such as the included dust hood, bigger outfeed and extra blades, the cheaper Dewalt won. One tentative vote, to be decided by a hunk of maple tomorrow.
IMHO, the Dewalt planer is an example of their efforts toward thoughtful design. Every detail is considered. I love the on board tool storage. For a portable planer though, this puppy weighs a lot. Of course it will be parked in my shop most of the time, so the weight was more of an unpacking issue.
In this day and age of brand engineering (you know, a Buick is just a Chevy with leather), you really need to be careful of any crap a vendor puts out in their good name. A lot of tool manufacturers spent a good part of a century building up their reputations, just so some fresh out of school MBA who never saw a customer before can source a cheap hunk of junk and sell in their good name. Look at every tool individually and you will be better off. Even good brands have good competitors.
I been swearing and relying on DeWalt since before they were deWalt. What I
mean by that is when Black & Decker bought Elu (who knows how long ago that
was now) I began buying Elu tools (mostly routers). Other people I worked with
would use them and comment positively on them and always ask asked me where
they could get them. When Black & Decker bought the deWalt brand name and
the yellow deWalt tools stated popping up I was one of the very first to buy
them too because I was quick to recognize them as being Elu tools in a new yellow
jacket.
Sure I can talk like the guys Don (D_Wood_NY) has referred to when he says
"... Nearly everytime I ask a guy how he likes his
Dewalt (insert any tool here) he always says "I love it. The trigger sticks,"
(or, "-it wont stay in reverse," or "-the table's half a degree
off...", etc.) but other than that, it's great." That's true
but I can find something a little quirk I don't like or have found a problem
with with just about every tool line except one. That tool line is Festool.
They are the only ones I can think of that I would rate ahead or the rest of
the field. I have and also hear plenty of "You don't
hear those qualifications with a lot of other tools. ". Sure ya
do, it all depends on who you talk too. Some guys like to complain and some
guys are more positive about their experiences with a particular tools like
me.
Today after four years of heavy duty service the switch is starting to go in
my Porter-Cable 19.2v drill so I grabbed an eight year old deWalt 18v to use
in it's place. That deWalt 18v drill was my personal drill till the switch went
on it. I needed a drill that very day so that's why I ended up getting the Porter-Cable
and I bought it as part of the Drill-Saw Kit. I got the switch fixed on that
old deWalt and it became one of the shop drills and it's held up with no other
problems other than having to replace the chuck two years ago. No it back in
use with me again.
No complaints with deWalt here and I take issue with any accusations with them
being short on engineering too. People will say what about Metabo and what about
Fein and while I have no complaints with them either I have fried the switch
on a Metabo 3" Random Orbit Sander right out of the box. My observation
is that electronic switches just aren't as tough ...yet... as the older types.
Electronic switches in general are the problem and not the brand make of the
tool. ( Sage advice-never buy an electronic switch dremels haven't had one make
it through a day yet but the older adjustable speed switch has served us just
fine). While you CAN call that bad engineering you CAN'T say as a generalization
that Metabo tools are poorly engineered. Same thing for Fein and I personally
have had a Fien detail sander die on me too.
We're a pretty good sized shop and we haven't had any "real" general
brand-wide problems with deWalts standing up to industrial level use. Same holds
true for Festool, Matabo, Fein, Bosch, Elu, Porter-Cable, and some of the European
stuff we have too. (There maybe some I am missing too).I confess though that
I have yet to buy anything from Rigid since they became a Home Depot brand and
I don't know whether I would. I'll stick with the girls I came to the dance
with I guess.
"Architecture is the
handwriting of Man." - Bernard
Maybeck.
I agree that all brands have their strong and weak lines. PC is the router and sander king and the Tiger saw will climb through walls like King Kong but I haven't heard much good about their nail drivers for instance.
But I am not making unfounded accusations about engineering. Theri own tech rep agreed with me on that. Actually, I think that the marketing folks got out ahead of the engineering guys saying, hey, we're going to market with that unit on ________date whether it's ready or not, let the warantee shop fix it later,
IMHO
When you buy a tablesaw and the arbor strips its threads on the very first blade change and then two years later, the nut explodes in the general area of your own nuts, you get the idea that there is some poor metalurgy and engineering going on.
With a corporate culture like that, how am I supposed to feel much loyalty or confidence towards them.
Some one else mentioned all the #one and two ratings that DW has in the magazines. That's fine for new tools - and all those toys they hurry to add to a substandard tool to be the first to market with help theose ratings. But the ratings that matter to me are which is still better in three or four years. I'll brobably be retired and building birdhouses and lawn ornaments before some of my Milwaukees wear out. They're twenty years young is all!Excellence is its own reward!
Milwaukee - poor ergonomics and bad electrical parts, especially cords. Definately not our father's Milwaukee tools. Makitas now...there's some "throw me down in the dirt and run over me a few times for sport and I'll still out work you tomorrow" tools.
The missus has a Honda lawn mower we wouldn't trade for 6 Briggs Stratton powered whatever brand you want to name mowers, too.
Brinkmann for president in '04
Jim, I know you do a whole bunch more serious carpentry than I do (handyman vs. carpenter) but I have never had an issue with the electrical or ergonomics of my Milwalkees. I have 2 Sawzalls a sidewinder and a 14.4 battery job. My biggest issue has been is that the hammer action in concrete on the 14.4 unwinds the keyless chuck - I should have known better, the DeWalt guys refused to sell me an accessory keyless for the DeWalt hammer drill.
I've worked with a Makita sidewinder and hated the way chips blew ino my face, especially treated (I'm in Vancouver, so I use the same wet, hart to cut stuff you do).
Mind you I've only had my big reds for about 2 years ....
Even Makitas went tru a bad spell especially with cords. I remember my bud going through three Makita cords while my Milwaukee stayed good in a couple years side by side. I don't hold switches going out against any manufacterer since I learned that Lucerne makes the switches for 80-90 percent of all the tools. That was maybe fifteen years ago so maybe more are making their own switches now...
Excellence is its own reward!
One thing that hasnt been said is the timming involved buying our tools. To buy the best tool, we would have to buy in the future. Men arent normally good at this , I know Im not. Im bad at waiting too long . [Like the day before at the earliest] Then I make a trip to Lowes , and I know I will pay more at the hardware store. So I get a tool I wouldnt have normally chosen. Lowes has a big selection of Dewalt tools . Nuff said ,
Tim Mooney
You are right on about the Ridgid / HD thing.
I have a Ridgid miter saw and I love it. I recently bought their contractor table saw and I think it is a great machine for the price. However, dealing with HD is ludicrous.
The table saw was missing parts, including the miter gauge and the safety power switch (rendering it useless). It took an extra day and three phone calls to get an intelligent answer let alone a fix. The supposedly included accessories like the dust collection chute has yet to arrive. They did give me a coupon to mail to Ridgid for the part that was not in the box. Of course, the coupon was expired. So far they have not addressed the issue and I'm tired of wasting brains cells talking to these idiots.
I'm sure the manufacturer has some culpability in this, but their biggest mistake is have those HD morons on the front lines representing them.
Oddly, you buy another brand of tools from HD and they stand by it. You buy Ridgid and they treat you pathetically. Maybe the exclusive/house brand relationship means they fear no retribution from the manufacturer.
Boy have YOU just started a long thread!
Their engineering is a little short, preproduction. I had a discussion about a problem I had with a couple of their tools with one of theri tech guys and he was a little put out with the engineering guys there and admitted that there was a problem with some engineering needing refinement. Specifically arbors and arbor nuts. The metals they use are a little on the weak side too. It's a young outfit, run by young guys who have some creativity and innovation on the plus side but excessive profit motivation and inexperience on the down side. So their tools don't last as long in heavy use as they could.
That's the short of it IMHO
I am a diehard DeWALT user. I don't care if the service reps spit on me the tools are just worth the $. I work with a guy (he's a makita fan so I'll leave his name blank) who (for the first four months) would do nothing but complain about DeWALT, their line, the way they work, basically everything about them. Well now after seeing my tools in action and using them often he is looking into buying some of his own. I own the 18 volt four pack, palm sheet sander, portable table saw, 2 hp plunge router, blades, accessories. I beat them up everyday (my drill took a header off the top plate of a credit union we were building and I only need to replace my magnetic drive guide 5 bucks). To make a long story short I dont get why folks hate them either.
I'll take this opportunity to share a recent experience I had with DeWalt. I finally decided to buy one of their 12" compound sliders. Put my money on the counter and drove for the shop where I immediately unpacked the saw and grabbed a milled and jointed board to cut. 90…okay Left 45…..open on heel. Right 45..open on heel. ??????? Held the blade guard up and watched it slow to a stop. HUGE wobble in the blade. 40 thousandths runout 1 inch from the edge of the blade. I removed the blade and checked it. It's okay. Next, I setup to check the arbor for runout. 6 thousandths runout at the arbor!!!! The bearing was pressed so crooked that you could see the balls with the naked eye. I returned to the store of purchase with dial indicator in hand and tested four more saws right in the store. Only one was fit to bring home and to expect to get high end results from it. I brought that saw home and kept it. It has 3 thousandths runout at the perimeter of the blade. E-mailed DeWalt and received a cookie cutter reply that " this sort of problem is not typical of DeWalt power tools". E-mailed back and informed them that my tests proved otherwise & that I thought they'd best have a look into just what is going on with quality control. No follow-up replies from DeWalt. By comparison, my mid-1950's Delta Unisaw has 1 thousandths runout at the perimeter of its' blade. I don't expect those kinds of tolerances from the short arbor of this 12" slider, but neither should the runout be 40 thousandths. Last week, I was in the same store from which I purchased this saw just in time to see a guy returning an apparently new DeWalt 12" slider. I'm pretty certain that I know why. The saw is performing very well for me, but only after having spent hours of time resolving a situation that I should never have been confronted with. One rotten apple spoils the barrel.
That arbor problem you discussed is the smae one I talked to the tech rep on the phone about after one exploded on me. It was the arbor nut on the tablesaw that exploded into five pieces (this was apparently not the first time it had happened to them but the first guy on the phone was giving me the boilerplate runaround until I demanded satisfaction and went up the ladder ) Anyway, while I had someone with authority on the phone, I mentioned another trouble with my chop saw wobble getting worse no matter what blade and he said yeah, there's been some trouble with the engineering on that too...He sent me a new piece that helped about ten percent....Excellence is its own reward!
It seems a shame to watch, what is IMO, an easily resolved problem tarnish the reputation and performance of what seems to otherwise be, a great 12"compound slider. Mankind has been building bearings and pressing them on shafts for quite some time now and seemed to have the technique down to a fine art. So what's the problem now? I'm sure that the problem has multiple causes (including the profit motive), but after having worked a 2 ½ year stint in a factory during my youth, I'm convinced that the biggest problem lies with the lack of quality control. I've seen this before. The quality control boy is suckin' down boilermakers after work supplied by the guys on the assembly line. One hand washes the other. I suggested this as the possible cause in my e-mail to DeWalt, but I fear that they'd sooner fiddle than put out the fire. It's the same phenomenon that we all encounter on a near daily basis. Too many people would, for some strange reason, rather spend their time and effort devising a mental handbook of feeble & laughable excuses/explanations in an attempt to quell or hoodwink the unhappy/unfortunate client when it could be better/more constructively spent just simply paying attention to doing things right. No problem; no need for an excuse. To all of you who haven't had a problem with DeWalt yet………..I hope your experiences remain the same. I don't hate DeWalt because of the problem I had, but I will warn you about it so that if you go after one of those sliders, you know what to watch for. Perhaps one of these days they'll get this problem resolved, but until then you'd best take a dial indicator with you. Find one with a good arbor shaft bearing in it and you'll likely take home a good saw that only requires a minimum of tweaking.
I'm not one who hates DeWalt.
I have a 7.2 amp drill/hammer - a rebuilt (we have a service store in Vancouver and they sell factory rebuilts).
I was doing a job and it started slipping into hammer mode. I took it to the store, waited a week while they got the parts and paid $0.00. There was an issue with the repair, I took it back, they fixed it on the spot.
They were incredibly good when my new DeWalt Emglo compressor started dying on me. Did not even laugh when I found out it was a too weak cord/too long distance.
I have more Milwalkee than DeWalt tools usually because when I need the tool for a job, the one I need is not in stock as a rebuilt, and I get one heck of a deal at HD.
Buy a new one? Sure, any day. I love chewing up my Makita loving friends.
**At my age, my fingers & knees start work 2 hours after the reso of me is there***
I think some manufacturers do certain tools better than others.
I've always heard great things about Dewalt's 18V cordless drills. I think when my drill dies, I'll really consider getting one.
On the other hand... the only Yellow tool I currently own is a jig saw. I'm on the 3rd switch after only 1-1/2 years of moderate use. Damn thing keeps running when you take your finger off the trigger. Inconvenient, not to mention unsafe.
Makes me real leery of getting other stuff of theirs.
First of all, Im a Makita lover . Second is most of my tools are yellow . Why? Because every store around here carries Dewalt tools and accesories. I have a servive center 20 miles from my shop. I tried to get other tools fixed and its a big mess. Yes , I may have to pay for the repairs , getting no deals , but that service center works with me . Im not looking for a handout, just to be back in business.
That said ; Ive have had very good luck with Dewalt. Switches are supposed to be prone to go, but thats not my experience. I make no arguement with any one . I have a dry wall router that had a defective switch . [wont stay on ] I could have got that fixed or returned it. [my fault as its out of warranty ] Still no big deal.
IMO , The battery drills are in the top three, the table saw is at least second if not first , and the slider has already recieved first in two tests Ive read . I have seen the Makita win , but Dewalt be the choice for the money. The yellow planner has come under the flag as number one. Also the bisquit joiner and portable hand planner are in the top three. Their are a lot of things considered in these tests . Hardly ever will an author be comparing apples to apples. All considerations have to balanced. My balance is at the top of the thread . I do however prefer other tools like the pc vibrating sanders, bocsh orbitals, pc skil saws , pc nailers for the money,usually you can own two of them] But a bostich framing nailer. This could go on and on . Hence the great debate you started , like Piffin said.
My statement ;
I believe it is unfair to kick Dewalt to death, as is done most of the time , referring to them as "decrap". I dont think they deserve the bad talk. Im not saying they are the best , but I think its because they are market people like Piffin said. They are leading in sales !!!!!!!!They are in every store worth going to. Its not my fault Makita didnt get off their butt and try to compete , because they have very fine tools . Nuff said .
Tim Mooney
What's the beef with DeWalt? They suck, man! The only consistently good DeWalts have been the tools they didn't design, but rather bought and placed their ugly name on. (Elu, Emglo). I'll concede that their biscuit joiner is good, and a lot of the original 12" compound miter saws were good (a lot weren't too), and a lot of people seem to like the cordless drills, but the rest? There's always SOMETHING completely thoughtlessly designed. Case in point: the new Dewalt framing gun is light, compact and powerful, but it has a trigger lock that locks itself at random times, and its drive depth adjustment has only 4 settings. On the power planer, the tables were so out of whack it made a straight board crooked. I've seen MANY Dewalt Miter saws of some sort with a fence that didn't plane with itself.
They just don't care, and I like to associate with people that care about what they do/build.
Tom
Thank you Thomas, you just brought a smile to my face.
After my compliments on my new Dewalt planer and it's design, I went to use it for the first time today.
I thought it was cute that the table has a sticker on it apologizing for any wood chips in the unit, since they factory test the unit before shipping. I wonder what tolerances they expect in the factory test? The table was so far out of whack I could have planed a corkscrew. To be fair, it is user adjustable and it only took 5 minutes or so to true up. But that factory test tee hee hee...
Perhaps mine missed the QC since I didn't find any chips in it. Maybe the marketing guys should have thrown some in to keep the myth alive.
I`m not a big fan of Dewalt myself. Except for the 18v cordless drill, I find their tools lacking that little something. None of the others have impressed me at all. I own two of the Dewalt drywall guns and I hate em both, too much speed, not enough torque. I worked with the table saw for years and found it flimsy. Just not up to snuff.
I`m also not a big fan of Sony electronics either(If that helps to describe my demands). Like Dewalt, theyre not bad for the money, but I`d rather spend the extra and get what I deserve.
J. D. Reynolds
Home Improvements
"DO IT RIGHT, DO IT ONCE"
Ive got the 12" sliding Miter box Use it everyday in and out of the truck, Three years and going strong!!!!!!!! I was a doubting thomas at first, a real Porter Cable and Delta man But had a bad experiance with delta. No prob here
I'll second Tom's vote... they SUCK hardcore :-)
NMARKEY -Your advice sounds so intelligent, well researched, and thoroughly based on experience that you certainly have convinced me. I’ll never buy deWalt again.
...............yeah right. What a waste of bandwidth.
"Architecture is the
handwriting of Man." - Bernard
Maybeck.
Being that 'suck' is a verb, I have to wonder what a 'hardcore' is? If your intent was to use 'suck' pejoratively, perhaps you could have said 'they suck tremendously'
Whoop dee doo
oh, good selection.... the WHOOP DEE DOO JOINER DIP '96 (Big Success x Frances Joiner). One of the most perfect formed double blooms Jan has produced...Amber, and it seems to be one large, round amber ball. Petals are broad ruffled and lightly creped. Petaloids are large and swirl somewhat in the center. Scapes are graceful w/ up to 15 buds. Foliage is medium yellow green.
ROTFLMAO!
MHOTY
Gentlemen. On my mark you will both take ten strides forward, then turn and fire. May the best man win.
WTF?
Brinkmann for president in '04
EWI!