In the pic there is a bubbling veneer wall with signage attached. We replaced the veneer with 1/2″ panels, but the signage needs to be reapplied to the new wall.
The original sheet was removed and carefully laid onto the floor of the adjacent office (vacant) with signage still attached.
The pieces are attached to the wall with adhesive pads, no pins.
The original sign company wants $1,220 to come over and transfer from the old wall to the new. A local company wants $1,060. They ramble about templates and CAD files even though I explained to them both that it’s laying on the floor right next door in full scale and they can easily make a story stick or some story tape for the layout.
Anyhow, is there any reason I shouldn’t try this myself?
“I never met a man who didn’t owe somebody something.”
Edited 8/22/2007 4:07 pm ET by Buttkickski
Replies
If the letters are installed crooked and have to be removed, and if that damages the veneer, who pays to fix it?
"Put your creed in your deed." Emerson
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
Fair question. Worst case scenario: that panel that would have to be replaced costs $200 and takes about 1 hour to do...I know this the hard way.
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
I kinda get the idea the letters are made out of some sort of a plastic and are attached with double sided tape.
This is not much different than the emblems on a cars trunk lid. I work on cars to make a living, so here is what I would do.
Put a strip of masking tape under each word. Mark the bottom part of each letter on the tape. Measure how high the tape is of the bottom edge of the veneer. This is gonna be your template. I would try to razor blade the letters of the veneer. When the letters are off you might be able to peel the remaining double sided tape off the letters. If not trim it as good as you can with a razor blade. Go to your nearest auto parts store and buy a roll of 3M or ProForm double sided tape and attach it to each letter. Stick it on the new piece of plywood and you saved yourself over a thousand bucks.
Martin
Thanks Martin, that's exactly the process I had in mind. Slow and easy using story tape.
As an added bonus: the letters are actually cast aluminum w/powder coat so they're less likely to break.
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
I think it would be a waste to pay the sign people.If you are careful, this should be nearly as easy as falling off a log.It's not like you have to paint the sign back in. There would be a lot more chance of screwup if that were the case. But this is just peel and stick. Almost literally.Do use blue tape for marking.But I would suggest you get a large sheet of cardboard, and do a sort of template/stencil as well.Still using your 'story tape'... Lay the sign out on the cardboard. Use an exacto knife and cut out the letters and logo. Cut them out slightly small. Tape the template up, and -lightly- trace out the entire thing onto the wall, using your new 'stencil'.Now use the new tape and just tape up the pieces where they belong.
Yeh... That'll work.
Good plan, thanks.I could fly you up here for a day and pay you to do it and still save some money!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
You might want to wander past the local hobby lobby and ask for some frisket paper. It's prettu low tack, but would let you lift off the existing signage in its correct orientation. That way you could lay it out face down for application/reapplication of the double-stick or whatever holds it iup.
(And, yes, I'm just stealing the technique for mosaic tile <g> . . . )
That's a neat idea, but this is huge. That veneer panel is 4x8. Maybe use your idea but only one line at a time?
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
idea but only one line at a time?
Yeah, kinda what I was thinking anyway.
You could lash up a frame of lath to make a "story" frame for the hole panel, then work the pieces that way.
Oh, and you could use contact paper since it comes in nice wide rolls. You can cut the stickiness a tad with simple talc "dusted' over it, too.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
I have a rule that has served me well, most of the time. If I even think I can do it, I do it. The rational goes something like: if I do it and it's successful, I've saved money and I've learned a new skill. If it unsuccessful then I've learned I don't have the skill needed and it's just money
Thanks!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
Yeah, no problem.
If they are stuck to the old veneer too well, IIRC denatured Alch. will getthat tacky stuff un done.
Dude, thats the wall you were worried about? Hooooo-weeeeee, yes it's FUBAR..LOL Sorry boutthat..but damm..I never saw veneer bubble up like that. Thats scary shid right there.
Thanks for the alc. idea. I also have laminate cleaner I use for cleaning up contact cement overspray I'll try too.If you're still looking for another business path; evidently the sign business pays well!Yeah, those are the walls of hell. We ripped down all the veneer on Saturday and applied the new panels on Sunday...piece of cake. Festool saw & guides saved us hours since no wall was square or straight. We had written application instructions from the designer this time so if it falls down, I'm off the hook. It cost me $600 in labor but it may have saved me a $10,000 lawsuit so I'm ok with that. Plus it gave me justification to buy that sweet a$$ saw!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
I've done a lot of signage in the past and YES it does pay well.
I was wonderin, what type of veneer was it. Paper backed? Raw? PSA?
What kinda glue failed? I don't see how YOU could have FU'ed the install, it had to be the Veneer or the adhesive..right?
call me clueless (G)Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
http://forums.taunton.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=tp-breaktime&msg=90810.77That's the full story, but here's the condensed: The veneer was phenolic backed like laminate. It was recommended by a distributer for this application. They later denied that recommendation. It would cost me
more to prove it was the veneer suppliers fault than it was worth.
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
Roger that. I woulda CC'ed it if it was me. Sound iffy tho', Phenol =ridgid,+ veneer=movement ..= suxx. LOLSpheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
What's CC'ed?And I know >now< that it was the wrong product, but at the time I thought it was good stuff, especially since they said it was.
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
Sorry..Contact Cement.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
" It was recommended by a distributer for this application. They later denied that recommendation."
coupla years ago I installed a tile floor ... over hardi ... over "cushion backed vinyl" sheet good. hecked with hardi ... read all their stuff ... one of the reasons I went with them was it was approved for installation over "sheet good flooring" ...
maybe a year later ... cracking grout. I checked ... happened to be right at the 3x5 sheet lines ... picked up a hardi brochure and was ready to call ...
read the "new brochure" ... specifically said not to put on cushion backed vinyl!
knew I had an old brochure ... couldn't find it ... called Hardi ..
they said after much time and trouble ... they'd send out someone to see which portion of their product they'd pay to replace ... materials cost.
I just redid the whole damn job.
On the plus side ... got lucky ... wife who originally wanted hardwood won the debate ... so they got a very discounted hardwood floor.
coupla months after that ... I found that original brochure. No mention of cushion backed being excluded. Guess more than me had that problem.
Oh well ... live and learn ...
think in the end it just cost me $1,800 ... and the customers have refered me several times since ... so not a big loss at all.
Jeff Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
i must of missed the final decision on wheter to fix the problem or what. i take it you just boned up and replaced the bad veneer?
i would set up a laser with horz. line and start lettering. larry
hand me the chainsaw, i need to trim the casing just a hair.
With all the money you are not giving the sign guys, buy a nice projection tv. Take a picture of the lettering on existing sheet. Attach camera to projector. Project image on wall and put the letters up. Go home and watch a movie with your new projector.
And write it off as an expense!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
like everyone has said, itought to be pretty straight-forward. (Although a laser level could let you go buy another tool - a definite plus.) Looks like from the picture that the base of the rock aligns with the base of the letters. You could use masking tape instead of frisket paper but the idea's the same.
Keeping the bottom of the letters aligned isn't a huge deal but making sure they are all on there straight vertically could be. That's why tying them all together somehow is a good suggestion.
Thanks. A drafting triangle will help keep them vertical also. As technical as the original installers may have done it, the letters still aren't perfect!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
Our customers complain about our charges, and here we are complaining about another contractor's charges. Gee, don't they have to pay for the truck, WC, pay the salaried guy to drive to and fro and sit when there's nothing else to do, risk of damaging the substrate, yada, yada, yada...~$1k sounds about right to me!Brooks
Edited 8/23/2007 2:32 pm ET by Brooks
They're bidding high because they don't want to deal with it. I know this because there's a 2-3 week wait before they can do it.
The $1,060 bid came from a shop 7 blocks away. Everyone here agrees it's a easy job.
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
I don't care how much overhead the sign maker company has, paying the employee and insurance. 1000 bucks is a lot of money for a job that takes 3 hours max.Martin
The problem with what everyone excpet CapnMac has suggested is that the bottoms of all letters to not sit right on a straight baseline. Because of optical issues, certain letters--notably those with curved bottom elements--sit slightly below the baseline so that they appear to be sitting directly on it when viewed at the distance from which they were designed to be seen.
In small fonts such as those used in books and magazines, this is not visible except under a loupe (although the lack of it would be quite noticeable). In large headline type such as is used in full-page newspaper ads (96- or 128-point and up) you can see this effect pretty clearly if you align a ruler under two flat-bottomed letters (A, I, T, for instance) at opposite ends of the line of type and then draw a pencil line from one to the other. You will see that the line cuts right through the bottoms of all the curved letters.
For really large fonts such as those used in signage, the difference can be a substantial fraction of an inch...or even more for the huge stuff on billboards.
In any size type, if you align all the letters absolutely to a baseline, the whole line of type will look like the letters are bouncing up and down. It will look awful and very amateurish, even if the reader doesn't understand what's wrong. Do that with your sign here and your client will not be happy. That I can guarantee.
The way the professionals would do this is to generate a CAD-cut stencil on a sheet of low-tack transfer stock which is used as a full-sized positioning template. The software and hardware to produce this kind of stuff is not given away, of course, so the prices you got are not unreasonable.
If you want to do this yourself, you had better do essentially what CapnMac suggested, but not with frisket paper or anything that can twist or flex.
I'd suggest you use a sheet of eighth-inch acrylic or Lexan and a removable spray-on adhesive to firmly hold the face of the letters to the plastic before you remove them from the veneer. Then razor-blade them off the old veneer and clean the backs of the letters and apply the permanent adhesive. Finally, align the bottoms of the straight letters to a light baseline drawn on the wall with a fine-point grease pencil, and adhere them in place.
Once the permanent adhesive has grabbed, carefully peel/blade the plastic sheet off the face of the letters and clean off the low-tack goo with lighter-fluid and the grease-pencil baseline with Fantastic or Hertel.
PS--Note that the procedure I describe above will only work if the letters on the old veneer have not been pushed out of position by the bubbling. If they have, bite the bullet and call in the pros.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
That's all great advice Din but the good news is the letters are off the surface by 1/8" (that's a little over 3mm for you) so if I use the story tape method I will use wide painters tape and slide it up and under the letters to actually trace the entire bottom of the letter, not just the edge.I'm thinking the Lexan idea is best so far because it's nearly idiot proof and is pretty fast too...thanks!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
Well, good luck with it. If it doesn't turn out looking right, at least now you'll know why! ;o)>
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
Make sure you spell it right and don't have any leftovers
Yeah.........that would be kinda funny though!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
Umm...I said the (your) Lexan idea was best so far so I'm probably going to do that. Why wouldn't it look right if I did what you suggested?
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
The only thing I'd worry about is that the position of the lettering has shifted, either due to the bubbling of the veneer or during the removal process from the wall. If that's happened and you make a perfect transfer of the shifted lettering, you might not see it until it's up on the new wall.
Understand, it is possible to align each letter properly by eye, one at a time...but it takes years of graphic arts experience to be able to do that. (When I look back now at some of the work I did using 'press-type' headlines thirty five years ago, I cringe.) One thing I don't particularly like about the way CAD has taken over a lot of graphic design is that the 'artists' using such programs don't develop the artist's eye because the computer spits it out perfectly, so why bother? The mass invasion of computers into the graphics and typesetting business was the primary reason I hung it up and turned to something else in the early 80s.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
You probably remember Leroy Lettering too huh?Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"If you want something you've never had, do something you've never done"
Leeeee-roy?
Nope. Nevah hoid of it....
Press-Type and Quick-Stick were the two brands available to non-pros back then; later on when I learned what the hell I was doing I got the good stuff from Zipatone and Letraset...and then after years of relying mostly on text work Hallelulah I finally had enough ad work in the shop to justify buying a VGC Typositor.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
Yeah. Leroy was a template with the special pens. I remember letraset as well. My Moms SO. had a Graphic arts biz, my GF at the time ( soon to be wife) worked for him, and my brother was art director for Japan Air Lines..so's I got exposure to plenty..
Then worked at Eastern Continuos Forms, a printeing co that that actually still poured type in part of the plant. But mostly printed collated 5 part lineholed NCR and carbon forms.
I used to bale the scrap paper and offset alum plates.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"If you want something you've never had, do something you've never done"
I came along as hot type gasped it's last dying breaths, and wandered off as phototypography was given for free to the great unwashed as a bonus to enable computer salesmen to sell 'personal computers'.
Hot type men swore phototype was garbage, and at the beginning they were right. But it got better...until typeset output was made accessible to any idiot with a keyboard. Then it started getting worse as standards dropped and nobody seemed to care. WTF, it was free, eh? Who cares if there's no kerning; who cares if the leading is off? Who cares if the character comp is set wrong for the font size? Who cares?
"My secretary 'typeset' this whole advertising brochure and it cost me nothing! Boy, I'm never gonna pay some crook typsetter money again!"
Yeah, it cost you nothing, Mr. Businessman...nothing except a subliminal degredation of the public's confidence in you as a professional (instead of a hack amateur). But that's the way of it. Cheap is better than quality. It's all about numbers: Ask any number cruncher.
By now, only major publishers care enough about quality to actually buy real typography. Everybody else just uses the keystrokes....
Arrrgggg. Don't get me started. I lost that battle damn near thirty years ago, and I ain't going back there. I'm going to get my supper and another beer and watch a movie.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
When I got my Architecture degree in '72 Leroy was not used much anymore, at least not by Archy types, altho the engineers used it more (and they also used drafting machines, not parallel bars). If not hand lettered, we were using rub-ons like Letraset, and some the phototypositor or like the one you just mentioned. My training was all pre-cad, have no idea how to do all this gol-durn cad stuff. Ah, for the days and appearance of hand crafted drawings!
Yeah, my wife worked at the same printing Co. for awile, then went on to be a Drafter for a C.E. Firm, while she did that she took CAD classes and eventually got her Degree in C.E. too.
I still draw by hand, when I have to. Been awhile since I had to generate any drawings of anything tho.
edit: If you have ever used a Chiltons Auto Repair Manual, (from the 80's) my Ex, more than likely did the typeset and pagination.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"If you want something you've never had, do something you've never done"
Edited 8/25/2007 7:23 am ET by Sphere
Now there is an old memory jogged.I used to work at a printing plant as a baler operator. We would bale 40 to 60 bales a day of scrap paper.Thats 20 to 30 tons of paper.
We had 16" diameter pipe running all over the plant with vaccuum chutes at every machine.Had a 30' silo that the paper would collect then fall into baler,I spent most of my time unstopping that silo or shredding 4'x5' sheets of printed board that failed to meet QC .
ANDYSZ2WHY DO I HAVE TO EXPLAIN TO FRIENDS AND FAMILY THAT BEING A SOLE PROPRIETOR IS A REAL JOB?
REMODELER/PUNCHOUT SPECIALIST
I still have the blades we had set aggressively for cutting the roll cores from the presses, we had a 4" pipe stand welded up with a 4" pipe cut in half to hold the leftover roll.
A skil 77 saw. slide on the roll, and zip off layers as deep as the saw would cut, till ya get to the cardboard tube.
Yeah, bins at each press got pushed to the baling room, and hoisted up to the baler with a chain hoist ( after we separtaed the clean white out) and later when the plant expanded we actually got a pit baler.
All the "fluff" went thru the pipes, if ya made a bale without layers of fluff, they tended to slide around in the banding straps..and the fluff line DID plug up often.
The worst was dumping the drums of the "DOTS" from the line hole edges..talk about confetti. Oh, them and when a orney pressman would thow perf blades in the paper bins, they slice ya wide open.
Those were the days...real good $$$$$, hard work. We subbed it from the Co., then when they realized how much we were hauling in, they took it over under thier employees, and offered us jobs on the press line, I caught and boxed on a collater ( nightshift) for few weeks and said F this, and bailed.Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
"If you want something you've never had, do something you've never done"
I worked in the printing plant for 15 years as a carton finisher/baler operator/forklift driver.
Plough paid good money but I could see the writing on the wall so I started my own fence and deck company and when the closings looked imminent I was ready for a change.
ANDYSZ2WHY DO I HAVE TO EXPLAIN TO FRIENDS AND FAMILY THAT BEING A SOLE PROPRIETOR IS A REAL JOB?
REMODELER/PUNCHOUT SPECIALIST
Thanks Dino. It's on the floor now and bubble free.
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
Okay, dude. I got my fingers crossed for ya. WTF, you can't do worse than I've done on some of my first tries. If you don't try, you never learn anything new.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
lol...thanks!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
is that the 'artists' using such programs don't develop the artist's eye
Yep, I've distilled it down to one question--I ask about kerning. If they know anything about kerning they know more than about 80% of those out there "with experience." Give them loose letters and a blank space, and they're clean lost.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
AHA, and you being one of BT's resident ACAD genius/re-inventor/code wizards, oughta be the one to tell us all how to get the mtext output to kern itself, LOL...
Uh...could you put that in code bytes of one syllable ?? ;-) ??
Oh, yeah...for anyone who doesn't know what kerning is, it is the elimination of useless whitespace between pairs of letters. Like this:
LAVXY
If you put your cursor between the A and the V above, you will see the top lefthand point of the V is directly over the bottom righthand point of the A because the idiot so-called 'typesetting' program that runs your computer doesn't take into account the shape of the letters, only their overall width. In effect, it's only slightly more <intelligent> than a 1932 manual Underwood typewriter.
Good phototypesetters had some automatic kerning built into the mother boards; this was, of course, before the days of software programming for anything smaller than a mainframe. Cheaper ones like Compugraphic (what I had) enabled the typographer to do it manually but would not permit programming to do it automatically. For years after I stopped using that machine, everytime I typed the combination Ta or To or Av my right hand would automatically reach for the (-1 unit) key on the auxiliary keypad.
Why is kerning such a big deal? You could argue that it's not...but that extra space confuses the eye and makes the single group above (LAVXY) appear to be two groups (LA and VXY). Type consistently set like this slows down the reader and tires him out...and makes him dislike the book or magazine or ad he's reading. But very few people understand why, and the dislike remains at the subsconscious level.
But it still affects future purchasing behaviour.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
resident ACAD genius/re-inventor/code wizards
MText? That's easy.
First, have to have access to a better word processor/editor.
Second, it needs to accept external data sent to it. (So much for PageMaker <sigh>)
Third, it has to be logo-compliant with your o/s.
Then, under Preferences (Options in later versions), you set the default for MText Editor to that software (and, you can use things like wperfect.exe)
The 'trick' of it, though, is that the "engine" ACAD uses to map TrueType fonts like they are shx fonts will "de-kern" any poorly "brushed" TTF (like freebies or provided-by-m$). <invective with emotion> "Brushing" is the term-of-art for the method of creating characters in TrueType.
Now, as some one who cast the octants for shx files to make custom acad fonts, I can tell you it's hard work to just do half-donkeyed. I probably still have my "dummy" matrix drawing file, with its 225 prototype characters with cueing points for kerning, ascenders, descenders, sweeps and the like. Tiring to just think about at this point.
But, I'm biased, too. I used to slug text on a LinoType machine. Slug, lead, kern, glyph, m's & n's, all have distinct meanings to me. Certain aromas and memories, too--for what little that matters at this remove.
Woodcut, anyone?Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
I had faith you'd tell us more than we could possibly absorb, LOL.
Hmmmm. 'True Type' Fonts. Every time I see that phrase, I wonder mightily just how much royalty ITC is actually getting for each fake Helvetica out there wearing an Ariel name badge....
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
"I wonder mightily just how much royalty ITC is actually getting for each fake Helvetica out there wearing an Ariel name badge"
Your statement caught my eye. I thought I'd read somewhere that you can't copyright a font. I did a quick google and found this:
http://www.boingboing.net/2004/12/26/can_you_copyright_a_.html
I also recall a FLW/Prairie "inspired" website that sold a font they'd designed.
I have no opinion or other knowlege on this, just adding this to the thread hi-jack.
I thought I'd read somewhere that you can't copyright a font. I did a quick google and found this....
Sorry, that page won't come up for me because I don't have the web designer's favourite flash program installed, duh.
But the short answer is, yes, in the United States at least (which is where I owned my type and graphics business) you most certainly can copyright a typeface...and a user who wants the true face must pay a royalty to the copyright owner to obtain the matrices.
There are so many little eeensy-teensy ways in which a font can be minisculely modified to get around the copyright, though, that there are at least four times more fake versions of each popular face out there, and everybody in the business knows which fakes to use to fake in the real face. But high-end type buyers do not want fakes, especially if they are buying type to match an existing work or style. So ITC (International Typeface Corporation) licenses use of the original face and all its fonts for those machinery manufacturers who want to offer the real McCoy to their users.
When I bought a set of four fonts from CG, if it was an ITC face I paid $580 for the filmstrip master but if it was a CG knockoff or a generic face in the public domain, I paid $360. The problem was, I could not charge more for typeset output using the more expensive faces; yet I had to have them available so I could get clients to do business with me. As a text-oriented shop, this was not a major problem since I did not need to have a huge library of decorative display faces to meet the needs of the big advertising agencies; I only stocked about 70 or so classic text faces and a few display faces for the headlines.
But think of the investment in type fonts for a big ad shop which might have a library of over 3000 faces at $400-$600 each. That's why they were charging $4.00 per word for headlines while I was charging $1.50.
You never see all the expenses of a specialist until you get into it yourself. Thinking a sign shop is overcharging to ask $1000 to remount a piece of high-end signage is like thinking the remod carp who owns a $40-grand truck, $30-grand worth of tools, and has to stock another $8-10 grand worth of hardware, p&e pipe, wire, & fittings, and whatever, is overcharging when he asks $250 to come out and install a new door after a burglary.
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
There are so many little eeensy-teensy ways in which a font can be minisculely modified to get around the copyright
Yep, does not take much brushing changes to hit that >26% change point.
The harder part is keeping a "cheat sheet" to be able to translate BT Bookman CND IT into the font you own.
Scarier to me is the number of small shops with only semi-legal Pantone licensing. Ever gets slow enough (or the shops ever get rich enough--not likely, but possible), that will not be a pleasant visit by the Pantone attorney posse . . . Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
Ahhhh, the old PMS dilemma.
Having not been involved with colour specking since before PC's took over, I know not if anyone has been enterprising enough to create an equivalency chart between the 3-digit PMS system and the hexadecimal HTML codes for screen-generated colour. And if they have, what Pantone's attorneys think of it....
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
Edited 8/27/2007 1:52 pm ET by Dinosaur
3-digit PMS system and the hexadecimal HTML codes for screen-generated colour. And if they have, what Pantone's attorneys think of it....
Well, they are busy with the 5-6 people who found out the hard way that ALT+0169 and ALT+0174 both "mean" things. (And, mostly, it's still a depth-of-pockets test.)
PageMaker had a licensed Pantone Monitor to printer to PMS "calibration" system, which was a huge, giant, PITA, as the monitor settings never "stuck" or the printer settings never did. So, if you had to generate Pantone output, you either could WYSIWYG, or you could have a calibrated printer. Just not both. And heaven help you if IT upgraded the printer (or downed it for maintenance, or what have you).Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
Hmmmm. 'True Type' Fonts. Every time I see that phrase, I wonder mightily just how much royalty ITC is actually getting for each fake Helvetica out there wearing an Ariel name badge....
Well, note that the folk in Redmond were careful to not name theirs after the Fairey King in MSND (Arial not Ariel).
Then, there are athe various iterations of "Swiss" "Basel" (and "Basil") and "zurich" out there. I saw not to long ago, a reference to Bookman Swiss--talk about conflicts, Bookman 'owning" an ITC knock-off . . . ?Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
note that the folk in Redmond were careful to not name theirs after the Fairey King in MSND (Arial not Ariel).
Oooops.
Musta been a typo. Yeah, that's it, a typo....
Dinosaur
How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not broughtlow by this? For thine evil pales before that whichfoolish men call Justice....
Can you give a before and after sample of LAVXY ?
Thanks
That's what I thought. If I call back a painter to touch up some trim and he says $1,060 guess what...I'm going to be a painter for a day!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
"is there any reason I shouldn't try this myself?"
Well, there is the distraction of worrying about knocking the wig off that receptionist...
;)
Welcome to the
Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
lol I thought to myself that hair isn't real!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
besides the hair....is she picking her nose in that there "Pickture" ??
I think she's about too!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
Transfering something like lettering I'm most comfortable (as a carpenter) simply using horizontal and verticle refference lines duplicated on both pieces with blue tape to protect the new, and simply take careful measurements for each letter. That can easily get you within 1/32" from one panel to the other, which has got to be good enough for letters that big. I also like the story pole idea.
If carefully measuring a series with a simple tape measure is uncomfortable, you can also simply measure to the first letter on each row and use a dial caliper to get the distance between letters right on the money.
If blue tape is put on the sides of each letter towards the top and bottom, two simple pencil marks can serve as exact places to measure with the calipers. Write the distance on the blue tape and you're in business.
If you need a foolproof way to guarantee a hungover employee can't screw it up, tack up a straight edge under each row of letters, cut 1/4" mdf spacers to fit exactly between each letter, as well as under each letter to the horizontal straight edge if some letters sit low or high. Now it's simply a matter of moving each letter individually and it's spacers. Just kidding about the hungover employee: they are likely to put letters on backwards, upside down, or to leave out one here or there.
You can probably buy the double stick tape sheets from a sign shop.
Beer was created so carpenters wouldn't rule the world.
Another great idea, thanks.
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."
I'd try doing some rubbing, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubbing (espec. brass rubbing), With a large piece of paper you could get the kind of stencil used to place the letters by the pros...
Make certain it's well fixated and it should be easy. To place the letters I would tape the paper to the wall and cut a few holes with a sharp knife where the letters go and place double sided tape in the holes and place the letters. When all letters are placed carefully tear the paper and Voilá! a nice reproduction (hopefully).
My 0.02...
ooohhh...I like that one, thanks!
"I never met a man who didn't owe somebody something."