Good Morning!!
I have a job on a 125 year old house with the cast iron window weights still in use in 59 windows. We have to free up the old sash and get the windows to function properly. It’s a beautiful old house by the sea and the owner insists on keeping it as original as possible, right down to the ropes and weights in the windows. The problem is that someone has done some work on the windows before we got there and many of the ones that work open all on their own when they are unlocked..clearly the weights are in the wrong place. Would just simply weighing the sash and counterbalancing it with half the weight on each side do the trick? How did the old timers figure this out in the first place??
Thanks!
Replies
How about pulling out the old window weights, and cutting a couple of inches off? That should lighten them up a bit. And it should keep the homeowner happy, since you don't see the wieghts with the trim in place.
We are born naked, wet and hungry. Then things get worse.
Sizing the weights is important - they came in different weights, sometimes cast in a roman numeral on the weight itself. Once the window is freed, if it raises on its own obviously the weights are too heavy. I would attempt to locate a quantity of salvage weights in a lower weight category. You can determine what this should be by adding weight to the check rail (top) of the lower sash until the balance feels neutral. Divide by two and that's the proper size weight. You could cut the cast iron but it is hard to do and not easy to cut the right amount. You could also consider some of the sash weatherstripping available to add some friction between the sash and the frame. Are they being reglazed? Consider using DS (double-strength) glass - it varies only a little in thickness (2.25 mm vs. 3 mm) from SS but in an average sash this could easily amount to a pound or so.
T. Jeffery Clarke
You could also try stiffening the pulley somehow.
Andy
It's not who's right, it's who's left ~ http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM
Replace the ropes with sash chains.
Someone mentioned the possibility of stiffening up the pulley wheels. If it were me, I would not mess with this function at all. The tip on figuring out how to counter balance the sash to figure out the correct sash weight was a good tip. Sash chains in lieu of re-using sash cord is also a good idea.
As for cutting the weights...if you knew a place or person who would trade you the right weight for your sash weights, I would opt for this first. But if no luck, you can easily cut your weights using a burning torch. ( acetylene or LP gas will work just fine).
Davo
Edited 5/24/2002 12:44:07 AM ET by Davo
Davo,
You can't cut cast iron with an acetylene torch. (or an LP torch)
carpenter in transition
>> You can't cut cast iron with an acetylene torch.
First I've heard of that. I haven't done it myself, but I'm pretty sure I've seen references to foundries cutting off sprues and risers with a torch.
MAke your own weights. I had to do that once for a client. You can use the cardboard roll in a toilet paper roll or devise your own form and fill it with concrete, then I stuck a long fat eye hook in it which acted as a re bar and gave me the loop to tie my cord to.
Be well
Namaste,
Andy
It's not who's right, it's who's left ~ http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM
This may be obvious, but I ran into this problem once before.
In my case, the weights had been mixed up among the other windows on the house. The lighter weights I needed had been installed on a heavier window in the same house, which (of course) would not stay up.
You could use lead shot. A piece of pipe with a thread rod and washer to hold the pipe and pour as much shot as you need to get the window to operate.
I agree with csnow. If the client is serious about keeping it original, he won't mind you looking for the correct weights in the other windows. Sounds like you have to reand re each window anyway. Don't go cutting and slashing until you've had a good look.
If you need to make new weights, try filling pipe with lead and casting or drilling in an eyebolt.
Don't forget the possibility of salvage yard/recycle bldg. mat'ls. for the weights. Sash weights were of standardized sizes and dimensions.
Ken Hill
Find the oldest contractor in town. If he's like me, he has a pile of assorted window weights out behind the shop, salvaged from the demo's and replacements he's done over the years.
Excellence is its own reward!
Aint nothin a sawzall cant do...c'mon...I've cut through steel I beams etcIt's not who's right, it's who's left ~ http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM
If you're in SE Michigan drop me a line, my house came with a wooden box full of weights and I don't need any (the windows all work fine). You're welcome to see if any of them are the right size for you.
I guess they got collected at some point and I inherited them when I bought the house.
My house was built in 1894 and still has a number of the original windows. When we bought five years ago, only two of the old windows worked, so I've repaired several of these. In my case the ropes were broken, and I found most of the weights had fallen down into the wall cavity. I had to retrieve the weights and re-rope (use a blended cotton/nylon, and lightly oil the pulley). Where I couldn't find the originals, I looked at similarly sized windows, then found matching weights at our local building recycling center (the weights are often numbered).
However, in your situation, the weights are clearly too heavy. You should weatherstrip the windows irregardless, but it doesn't make sense to try and provide enough friction to overcome the too heavily counter-weighted sash. If the appearance of originality is your goal, use a quality cotton/nylon blend rope (not chains) and give the pulley, if you can get to it, a few drops of oil. Slowing down the pulley makes no sense because even with seized pulleys, you can still raise/lower the sash.
If you can't find the correct weights, and if you can't easily reduce existing weights, I'd use a 1" or 1 1/2" plastic pipe, capped at one end and filled with sand or lead as the counterweight - each weight should be (total weight of completed sash / 2). After getting the right amount of fill, make a hole in one cap for the rope, knot the rope then cap the tube. Try as much as possible to match not only the right weight, but also the correct size (height & diameter) so that the replacement fits in the cavity properly. The counter-weight should just come to rest at the bottom of the cavity when the sash is fully raised. Too much length and the sash ropes will go slack and not stay raised all the way -- too little and the window won't shut.
Ditto all that RCHANCE says about weighted double hungs. I work on a 1927 building that has a couple hundred of these and I've done many others. Forget the chains and use the nylon or nylon/cotton. Make very sure the rope is securely attatched to the weight AND to the window sash. If you're working on the bottom sash, you're in luck because usually you just pry off the stops and open the weight access door in the jamb. If it's an upper, then you have to remove the lower as explained above, then to do the upper you have to remzove the parting bead to get to it. That damn parting bead is often a bitch because of paint build up, and it's a friction fit. If you break it, which is easily done, then you have to either find or fabricate the correct sized tapered stock. Whew! Good luck!
Ken Hill
Ken
Thanks for the tips. The sash weight/2 was the key.
Moose
Thanks so much for the tips. The sash weight/2 was what I was after. Seemed all to obvious but needed to hear it from someone else.
moose
.... OR, you can Buy new weightsand have them shipped to you, once you determine the correct size.
T. Jeffery Clarke