On our plans we are to the point where we are deciding where and what kind of windows we want.
Whats a good site where we can look at window pricing?
We are trying to decide whats a good size for a picture window without making the house too expensive, it seems like going up a few inches sometimes means a difference of more than $100 bucks while the previous step up might have only been $10. We are already being careful about not placing windows so low that they need to be made with tempered glass since that seems to be an instant increase of at least a couple hundred.
Thank you for any help you can give us,
–Carlos
Replies
we need more info. what kind of window? obviously vinyl is the cheapest, but they're such garbage i wouldn't put them in a doghouse.
you probably won't be able to get a price off a website, you'll have to talk to a salesman (person).
but, for value for money, i like the pella proline series.
We probably won't be going with vinyl. But we don't know the type yet either. We've talked to a few sales people here and emailed a few companies as well. I just hate industries where pricing is guarded and only given by sales people!
I'm not so sure the Internet is a good place to shop for windows... In your other thread I think you got some ideas for some brands so you might use the Internet to go to those web sites and and click on the "find a supplier in your area". If they aren't locally available cross them off your list. You need to deal with a real person on this one.
I'd recommend going to some lumber yards and talk to some salesmen. With the way the building industry is these days, I'm sure they will have time for you. You might want to start shopping by phone. And BTW - if you go to some big box stores don't plan on having a lot of help - you need to be fairly self-sufficient to go to one of those.
I know in your other "window MFG" (or similar) thread it went on for a lot of posts, hopefully you got an idea of what to look for.
Regarding performance specs, I don't know how much that was discussed, but it can get confusing; the basics are:
1) U-value (insulation value - lower# is better),
2) SHGC (solar heat gain coefficient- how much solar radiation (heat) is let through) ,
3) VLT (visible transmitted light or how well you can see through the windows (and their coatings) - higher# is better). This last one is personal preference.
The windows should be rated by the National Fenestration Rating Council (NFRC). (assuming you are in the US.
Edit to add: I was typing while you did your last post. As far as pricing being guarded, you gotta understand that whatever you buy will likely mostly be made for you. It's not like grabing 2x4s off the big box rack.
Edited 1/20/2009 10:36 am ET by Matt
I would stat away from Pella. Your paying a lot just for the name. I have built many homes and have the least call backs with Certainteed vinyl windows.
Thanks for all the info.
So is there no standard measurements of windows that would be cheaper? or will they always be custom sizes?
I would first decide on a manufacturer and then get a catalogue with their standard size charts to determine your window schedule. Once you know the sizes you want, then you can get meaningful quotes. There are no industry-wide standard sizes that apply to every manufacturer (at least that I am aware of).
Of course, nearly every manufacturer will make windows to whatever size you specify, but from a cost perspective, chosing from "stock" sizes (which vary by manufacturer) is your best buy.
And by the way, HD does not keep every standard size in stock. They generally stock a dozen or so of the most popular sizes. If you pick a standard size from Andersen's catalogue, it may be a "special" order because they don't happen to keep it on the shelf.
Yeh, that's correct! I think you pay something like an 8% premium for a non- stocked window plus I know you have to wait for it..
I ordered a Gothic arch window and it was 5 months before I finally got it..
When I selected windows I went down to the store with a pad and a pencil and wrote down the stocked sizes.. Then as I was near every other Home Depot I would check to see how many of that size they carried and if they had anything differant..
I wound up with 96 windows (not all of them are Andersen's, I made several myself)
"I have built many homes and have the least call backs with Certainteed vinyl windows."
Was this before or after they were bought by MI?
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
That would be both.
When I was looking at the same issue I found to my shock and horror that I got the best deal on stocked windows at Home Depot.
I had looked at all the discounters and overstocked places. plus the scratch and dent sort of places that had many misordered or wrong sized returns and still Andersen wound up being as cheap or cheaper than the best package I could put together anyplace else..
Those that know me and what a cheapskate I am realize that that's saying something..
Apparently you just can't beat volume purchasing..
Interesting, from looking around at home depot it didn't seem like they were too expensive but I had very few places to compare with. As soon as we are done with the schedule of windows we will get some quotes I guess. I was really hoping to find pricing online (not necessarily buy) but I guess I'll just have to contact a few sales people.
If you are in the trade, there are better prices that HD
I am in the trade and HD's pricing on Andersen's is generally as good as I can get anywhere else, usually just a little better than anywhere else actually (sadly). Almost always their prices are within a few bucks of my local millwork supplier. Perhaps if I was buying 10,000 units at a time I might be able to do better.
Yeh that's pretty much my experiance as well.
I sold equipment to thousands of contractors including some really big ones and they all offered to help me with windows but the prices I found at Home Depot off the shelf were as good or better as anything they could get for me..
Since I started with a clean sheet of paper it was easy to design around the stocked units and very nice to get in the truck and go pick up what units I wanted when I needed them rather than have them sitting around risking getting damaged..
Not around here. I guess it depens on which model you are buying.
Andersen has pricing online.
http://andersenwindows.com/
hahahaha I hadn't even noticed that. Thank you. Now I feel like an idiot :-)
Are those reasonablely similar to actual selling prices.I know that the "list prices" shown in electrical equipment catalogs is 5 to 10 times selling price..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
I think Andersen picks it's dealers. I can't get them through our local yard, have to go through Stock Supply... same prices as online.http://www.tvwsolar.com
I went down to the lobby
To make a small call out.
A pretty dancing girl was there,
And she began to shout,
"Go on back to see the gypsy.
He can move you from the rear,
Drive you from your fear,
Bring you through the mirror.
He did it in Las Vegas,
And he can do it here."
The prices they post are pretty generic.
I get much better pricing through a local dealer.
I have been very happy with my MI vinyl windows. They are sturdy, well made, and have quite a few bells and whistles for the money. 30 windows for $5,200, new construction (nailing fin), energy star rated (good u-value), insulated low-e argon filled glazing units. This included six large egress size windows (min. 3'4x5'6) and the rest were kind of standard 28 x 40 or so. That's $175 a window approximately, I think. Good starting point.
One of the other guys here hooked me up with this site:
http://www.bestofbuildingscience.com/
Go there and there are several videos to watch that talk about selecting windows.
The mention above of buying windows at a big box got me interested. Some years ago I tried this and it didn't work out. Salesmen didn't know their product, seemed too busy for me, suggested I modify my house plan to fit what they had in stock, took weeks to get pricing, etc... Plus, I want them installed by whoever sells them by people who specialize in doing that so as to have a comprehensive warranty.
Anyway, today I was looking for a good deal on 6 font porch columns so I went to both HD and Lowes and checked the windows while I was there. The possibility of the convenience of off-the-shelf windows intrigued me.
Lowes: sold ReliaBuilt (sp?) apparently a house brand for Atrium. They also sold ThermaStar a house brand of Pella. I noticed that none of the display windows had NFRC stickers on them so I asked about that. Lowes had no windows in stock that were up to our current energy code for new construction which requires Low-E windows. So all new construction windows are special order. Mark that one off the list.
The orange bourg: sold American Craftsman a house brand for Silverline who are owned by Anderson. They did have some sizes in stock and they were Low-E. They are a fairly basic vinyl window that conforms to code minimums. Also, I can get them cheaper else-where. They also had Jeld-Wen(sp?) which are all wood windows, again, fairly basic. Again, maybe 8 or so sizes in stock. Anderson windows were available via special order.
If I'm gonna special order windows I prefer to deal with building professionals, and, again, want them installed by the vendor. No finger pointing....
BTW - they didn't have any 9' or 10' columns for me, which I thought was interesting since as far as I know 95% of the homes being built in this county have at least 9' ceilings on the first floor, meaning any columns used need to be at least around 8'-9" tall.
So, again, I am reminded that these home stores just don't cater to people who build homes.... Weird... They are great hardware stores though...
Matt
It's unusual that two people could have such radically differant experiance with a Big Box store..
First let me say that my disrespect of Home depot is probably as great as yours.. trust me I'm no Home Depot lover..
However my windows were cheapest at Home Depot over what the best price any of my contractors could get me.. (and we're talking about contractors who built 20 to 100 homes a week)
I used off the shelf Andersens (by the way they get offended when you call them Anderson .. that's Swedish and Andersen is Danish ).
I also purchased my 9' columns from Menards because they were the same price as those stocked by Home Depot but the onces Menards had were a full 2000#'s stronger than the ones sold by Home Depot. They too were in stock as was Home Depot..
Just our of curiosity, what prices did you get for what windows? We always buy our windows through a supplier, it just seems to work out better that way.It's been a long time since I got pricing from a big box store on windows, although I did price an Andersen gliding door about 6 months ago from HD. The price through our supplies was a little cheaper and the support was world's better than HD.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
Jon, That will take a lot of digging, please bear with me, I'll dig through the recipts tomorrow morning..
It's really not that big of a deal. I'm more curious than anything else.Go water-skiing on your lake instead or something else enjoyable.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
Jon Blakemore.. It was harder than I thought, surprisingly a lot of my Home depot recepts have completely faded! However One recept shows the TW 3052 at $241.00 (I bought 26 of those over the years) ..
I don't think that included the screens or grills
a TW 3052 is a tiltwash (or double hung that tilts for inside cleaning) for a 3'2" 1/8th by 5'4" 7/8ths rough opening.
I could have used up to a TW 3462 in the same place but they would have been more than $120 each more expensive plus the 8% order fee for a total of $390 each.
with the total added cost of $3874 dollars just for the one size..
Uh, you might wonder why I choose not to follow your advice about going water skiing???,,
Somehow that didn't seem very much fun since it's 19 below outside and the water is extremely hard with a white powder like substance a foot or more deep on top.
"Somehow that didn't seem very much fun since it's 19 below outside and the water is extremely hard with a white powder like substance a foot or more deep on top."No need for a life jacket then.
Jon Blakemore RappahannockINC.com Fredericksburg, VA
Ahhh! But I can walk on water!
Frenchy,Feel free to walk. I'M DRIVIN!! Its too cold to be walking out there. :)
>> It was harder than I thought, surprisingly a lot of my Home depot recepts have completely faded! << not surprising at all. I think they are printed by a thermal process or something like that. What I do know is that if I carry them around in my wallet for a month or 2 they fade beyond recognition. Not good when I am looking for a refund from my company for material that I have purchased for a job. Guess where I don't do most of my incidental material shopping...
Actually I wouldn't call them great hardware stores. It depends on what you want. If you wanted some specialized screws for example, True Value or Ace would be much better places. Heck even things like sanding paper I was able to find a better selection at those two places than at HD or Lowes. Its kind of funny, any time I go to a True Value they are very helpful since there are 2 or 3 people helping and I am the only customer in there, I feel so bad when I buy a lot of some screw type or washers or something like that and my total comes out to 3 dollars, after the guy spent 10 minutes helping me choose it.
Yea... I just finished up some houses downtown. There was a small mom&pop style hardware store like 2 blocks away. Maybe 2x the size of a 7-11. May have been a Tru-Value - can't remember. I can't explain it but every time I went there they had what I needed. Not that I still didn't make my bi-weekly stops by Lowes on the way to the job site, but the little hardware store came through for me a number of times when I just needed some screws, a little can of stain, a paint brush, sandpaper - or whatever... Some of it is knowing what to expect at a particular type of store....
Early last year I was building a few houses and there was a hardware store right down the street. This one actually had some lumber. Early on in the project I needed some form wood. Went there and got some 2x4 studs.... They were $5 each!!! I was shocked. Anyway, I didn't end up buying a lot of stuff there...