Hi all, I have this “old” ‘1920’s era house. I wantewd a few sconces placed in my hallway. I have them wired together into an existing light switch is being fed from the existing ceiling fixture. I am having a problem w/ two of the three only coming on dim, the third(placed between the two sconces) not doing anything, even though they’re all getting power.
I love wiring and cannot figure what has gone wrong. I do however hate having the fixture sourced…then going to the switch. Is this possibly the preoblem? Or…can I not add additional fixtures from that switch…and will need to provide a different means to energize the sconces?
Thanks in advance for anyones help!
Tony
Replies
Sounds like you maybe wired 'em in series? In the box for each fixture, connect the black wire coming in (power in) to the black going out to the next box. Same with white. Then connect the black wire from the fixture to the black bundle; same with white. For the last box, just connect black to black, white to white. Don't forget to properly ground the boxes if they're metal, and the fixtures.
Another possible problem is that your switch may not in fact be "fed" from the ceiling fixture, but may only be a switch leg -- can't tell from your post. In which case, you need a new plan for getting power for the sconces.
That said, it sounds like, although you love wiring, you may be in over your head on this one and it may be time to consult a pro.
Mike Hennessy
Pittsburgh, PA
Everything fits, until you put glue on it.
Hadn't even considered series.....
Everybody types faster than me.
JimNever underestimate the value of a sharp pencil or good light.
Hi Mike, I also "found" (a little shocking, of course) the ground was energized!. I believe I found that source to be coming from a faulty switch located in my office.
As for how the wires are ran/connected..I have only one 12-2 coming into the switch; one of course is hot. I'd wired the add'l lighting as you detailed.
Even w/ the bare ground now not being energized, the sconces(of them) are still dimly lit. All three are getting power. I'm going to throw a voltage meter I have on them and see what is going on.
If I have to, I'll talk w/ my sparky friends(even though they'll rib me about not talking to them in the first place!!!).
Thanks!
You have a classic mess. Your switch is not a good power source -- it's only a switch leg. It has no neutral. You need to get power from another source.
It's time to man up and take the ribbing from a pro and get this done properly. It's just plain dangerous as it is now.Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PAEverything fits, until you put glue on it.
Thanks Mike..yes I think you're right about all..dangerous & needing to get power from another source.
Tony
I assume you have already checked the quality of your connections.
>> them wired together into an existing light switch is being fed from the existing ceiling fixture.<<
So, perhaps only a switch leg exists between the existing ceiling fixture and the switch? How many conductors in the switch box? Are you sure a neutral is present in the switch box? If only 2 conductors are present - it's a switch leg run which lacks a neutral.
>> I am having a problem w/ two of the three only coming on dim, the third(placed between the two sconces) not doing anything, even though they're all getting power.<<
How much power? How measured?
>> I love wiring and cannot figure what has gone wrong. I do however hate having the fixture sourced...then going to the switch. Is this possibly the preoblem?<<
If a switch leg is indeed what enters the switch box, then you would have to tie in your new sconces at the existing ceiling box rather than at the switch box in order to obtain a neutral connection point for the new sconces.
>>can I not add additional fixtures from that switch...and will need to provide a different means to energize the sconces?<<
Perhaps, or need to tie in the new sconces at the ceiling box rather than the switch box in order to obtain a neutral connection. What confuses me from your description is how the sconces come on at all.
Jim
Thanks! I'm going to check into this more w/ a voltage meter...and if needed I'll ask my sparky friends for advice.
Take one bulb out and note what happens, Take another out and note what happens, then report back.TFB (Bill)
Will do!
>>I have only one 12-2 coming into the switch; one of course is hot.<<
One conductor from the 12-2 connects to one terminal on the switch, the other conductor connects to the other terminal? Position of connections makes no difference.
This sounds just like a switch leg to me.
Assuming this is indeed a switch leg....when you go investigating with your volt meter....you should find 120V +/- in one conductor of the 12-2 could be either the black or white, if the white it should be recoded with black marking of some sort (may not recoded due to sloppy workmanship). The remaining conductor will show no voltage.
Open the existing ceiling box where you think the power comes from .... somewhere in that box you should find the other end of the 12-2 that goes to the switch box and find a white wire connected to a black (this white wire should also be recoded)... most likely location for this "black-to-white" connection is at the fixture wire feeding the existing ceiling light.
If this is a switch leg that enters the switch box .... you have no neutral source present in that switch box.......new sconces will have to be connected in the existing ceiling box in order to connect to a neutral - old switch will then operate old ceiling light and the sconces from the old switch.
In order to fully understand this circuit you will need a meter which will measure voltage and check for for continuity. Don't forget the light bulb filaments will produce continuity between black and white at some locations in the circuit.
JimNever underestimate the value of a sharp pencil or good light.
Yes I will check into all of the connections in the ceiling bosx..This guy I bought the house from has done so-much poor-quality work...I am always amazed whenever I do something on it!
Something as simple as wiring in sconces should have been a walk in the park for me.
If it isn't electrical...it's plumbing..if it isn't plumbing..it's structural!
"This guy I bought the house from has done so-much poor-quality work...I am always amazed whenever I do something on it! "Switch leg wiring is perfectly normal and accepted practice.What might have been done wrong, however, is not connecting the white to the supply hot and not remarking the white, at both ends, to indicate that it is a now being used as a hot..
William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe
Hi Bill...The problem as it turns-out is I cannot feed the other fixtures from the switch leg, per my electrical inspector...I had a feeling of this...sooo I'll put in another box, source from a recept. close to the switch. I would rather feed from the ceiling light but all that is in concealed space(between levels)...trying to deal w/ the plaster would not be good.
Thanks!
"Switch leg wiring is perfectly normal and accepted practice."
Just to clarify for the OP, switch leg wiring is fine, but you simply cannot pull power from a normally wired switch leg box, 'cause there's no neutral in the switch leg box -- only one switched hot. It's not the switch leg wiring that's the issue -- it's trying to use the wire feeding the switch leg for something else.Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PAEverything fits, until you put glue on it.
Yep, it's the way things are.
JimNever underestimate the value of a sharp pencil or good light.