Alright, I’ve posted this before (awhile ago) and never got too many responses and none that were actually helpful.
Anyway, I have a house with a slab on grade and I’m looking to put a new wood floor in it. I doubt that there’s a vapor barrier below the slab because of the age (mid-1950’s) and I’m wondering the best way to put the wood floor down. I would like to avoid putting any type of sheathing down and would love to float the floor somehow but I don’t know if this is a good idea.
Anybody have any suggestions?
J
Replies
I put 3/4 CDX sheathing down under white oak 16 years ago and had a good floor for years until a leak under the slab caused buckling. I used heavy felt paper as a vapor barrior.
Some people advocate laying wood on slab over sleepers. I don't know the best practice there.
You might try the flooring forum at hardwoodinstaller.com
"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it." T. Roosevelt
I'm looking to put a new wood floor in it
Well, if I read that one way, you have an existing wood floor. If so, following that floor's installation would be a good guide.
If you are adding a wood floor where none was not before, then the first thing to look at are the transitions. As a guess, you'll need to go from existing ceramic tile to the wood (easy-ish) from existing carpet to the wood (bit trickier) and vinyl tile or sheetgoods to the new wood (can be a real pain).
Your transitions will tell you how "tall" you want to be (which will be an average, not an absolute number). That's what you want to know before shopping for floor product.
It could be that all you really need is the prefinished "snap lock" flooring, which is durable, sturdy, and reasonably-priced (if not "real" wood floor). Now, it could be you need 1/4" or 3/8" luan under your new floor to better hit your transitions. Might not. Hard call for me to make behind a coule computer monitors in Texas <g>.
"It could be that all you really need is the prefinished "snap lock" flooring, which is durable, sturdy, and reasonably-priced (if not "real" wood floor). "You are confusing the issue.You can get enginnered REAL WOOD flooring that snap locks or is glued (to each other) for a floating floor. And it is usally prefinished. Although there might be some that is unfinished.And there is laminate flooring that is most snap and lock today and is floating. It is not finished, either pre or post. It does not need a finish.Either one can be floated on a slab over vapor barrier.
You are confusing the issue.
Oops, my bad. This three-day week business is confusing enough as is.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
"Either one (enginnered REAL WOOD flooring that snap locks or is glued; laminate flooring that is most snap and lock) can be floated on a slab over vapor barrier."
Yes, but the OP should find out how 'flat' his slab is, and how tolerant the intended product is to the usual slab surface defects.
Right now I actually have carpet in the room that I want the wood floor in. I actually already have the wood floor - it was salvaged, which may make things a little trickier. Most of the tongues are in pretty decent shape because I was extremely careful (to a fault) in removing the floor. So when I said new wood floor I just meant new to the house.
I was hoping to avoid a wood subfloor, luon...etc, because of the transitions. Everything is built right on the slab. I haven't had time to check out the website that someone else had suggested - work gets in the way.
I have the article about glueing wood floor to the concrete but without that vapor barrier I'm a little worried about it. The tar paper idea sounded good too - I just don't know how good of a vapor barrier it really is for this situation.
I hate slab on grades. Thanks to everyone so far for the input.
J
Dear fairban9...I myself have had little hands-on experience with slab on grade floors but can simply give you a couple of examples of how "real" wood floors have been put down by two gentlemen I work with. To start, one application used a "red pine", all varying widths from 8" to 12", milled to 3/4" thickness, tongue and groove, planed on top, relief cut on the backs. The other application used hand-planed red pine stained "Early American". Both applications were put on over "newly-poured" (last ten years or so) slabs. PT strips/sleepers were ripped to whatever width was needed to match other floor heights and laid out two feet on center. "Tapcon" screws were used to fasten the PT strips to the slab. After, both applications used rigid foam insulation ripped to fit in between each sleeper. They made sure that the appropriate thickness of rigid insulation was not greater than the height of any part of the sleepers or the floor would not fasten well to the sleepers. I would imagine that if your floor is sound, but uneven, you could use cedar shakes to shim up any part of the sleepers to attain a more flat surface. Another difference between the two applications was that 3/4 subfloor plywood underlayment was put down on the sleepers until he was ready to have lumber milled. When he finally applied it, the flooring was fastened through the red pine, through the underlayment and into a sleeper.As for a vapor barrier, I guess you could put down 6mil poly over the insulation and sleepers before laying down your first floor board. Another note...I have noticed that on one of the floors that was applied, there is a large amount of buckling. I would think that the lumber may have been too dry when fastened and when summer and the humidity hit, it buckled, OR, there could have been more space left for expansion around the borders. Both floors, however, have that hollow sound when you walk on them, but not as severe as a composite flooring material.You did mention that you are planning on using salvaged wood, so, I would imagine that some extra care would be needed to make sure that it is laid correctly....Best of luck and I hope this did not come to late!!
I'm just finishing up a basement remodel project where I took out all the carpet and put down a prefinished engineered oak floor on top of dri-core subfloor material. The dri-core panels are 2' x 2' tng and just float. The engineered oak is then stapled down to the dri-core (with rosin paper in between). Worked great, looks awesome. A bit pricey though, and you lose about an inch of ceiling height with the dri-core.
Just curious....was your slab dead flat, or did you have to deal with swoops & floor drains?
It was pretty level, but needed shims in a few places. The floor drain didn't come into play, since it is in the mechanical room (which did not get the wood floors).
rip some 4" sleepers from 3/4" PT plywood, install 16"o.c. across slab w hilti fasteners can put 1/4" glue bead of subfloor adhesive on bottom of sleeper strips use 1 1/2" flooring nails or staples which will be contained within the PT Ply sleepers, not shooting under them flooring installs perpendicular to sleepers, have some scrap blocks of PT sleeper to place under butt ends of boards not supported by sleeper strips as you floor, it prevents "floating" end seams which r weak and noisy sleepers r better than ply underlayment; provides some ventilation which fights mildew, etc.