How I Fixed Window Condesation!!!
I built our house in 1988 & moved in 1998, We have Anderson double hung windows which have always let in a lot of air, especially at the parting rail & always had a lot of condensation and at times ice, a lot of ice. We are located in SE Wisconsin.
The household has 5 people living in it, so that’s 5 people X,s showers, dishes, laundry cooking & just plain living, a lot to ask of windows. In years past I have run a dehumidifier on the the living floors to help combat this problems, helped a little & cost a lot to run not to mention the noise.
This past fall I really looked into this & this is what I found & did.
1st. I changed out the kitchen hood from a charcoal reciculator to directly venting the hood outside. This was probably the biggest help.
2nd. I changed the bath fan from a 50cfm to a 110cfm, plus its extremely quite now.
3rd. I added a fresh air intake from the outside to the cold air side of the furnace, I used insulated flex to a manual damper control & then plastic dryer flex for the balance of the run, this way the warm basement air can temper the cold outside air before it hits the furnace. The furnace fan pulls in ample outside air and if I want to boost the flow I can switch on a power intake fan.
4th. I added new weather stripping to the windows & have yet installed the storm windows. I used a close cell foam strip along the top & bottom sashes making sure the foam was pressed firmly against the side jambs. At the parting strip my Anderson windows have a plastic fin that I removed & then reinstalled after I ran another strip of closed cell weather striping again making sure both end were pressed firmly against the side jambs.
Our windows are incredibly dry this winter & the air quality is very good. I know this topic comes up here every year so I thought I would post some of the things I did this year & what the outcome has been so far.
In total we spent around $225.00 & several hours time. Money & time well spent!
I hope this helps any of you that have this problem.
Paul
No one should regard themselve as “God’s gift to man.” But rather a mere man whos gifts are from God.
Replies
I had done the same as your 3rd measure a while ago. It made a huge difference by itself. In addition to bringing in drier, fresh air, I suspect it allows the inside/outside air pressure to equalize and so less cold air is being drawn in against the windows.
Recently I had a high efficiency furnace installed which draws outside air for combustion and direct vents. Since the stack effect has been lowered (there's still some because of the water heater), I closed off the return intake. So far this year I have not had any problems with window condensation.
I believe adding the fresh air intake had done a lot to correcting the problem, its good to hear it worked for you. Our homes air seems less stagnate this year & has better air quality. I have to get a humidistat to check, but the air doesn't seem to dry at this time either. Changing out the range hood seems to really pull a ton of moisture out also. Our house has two and a half oak forest worth of millwork in it & all is staying put, some of my cased openings have 35 to 50 pieces of casing around them per side and all rooms have from single to ten pc crown, That's thousands of joints to watch.
All & all we are real happy with the results this year. No one should regard themselve as "God's gift to man." But rather a mere man whos gifts are from God.
Paul
Our house has two and a half oak forest worth of millwork in it & all is staying put, some of my cased openings have 35 to 50 pieces of casing around them per side and all rooms have from single to ten pc crown, That's thousands of joints to watch.
I don't mean to be picky but how do you have 35-50 pieces of casing per side of a opening? Assuming 2 sides and one top and an average of 42 pieces per opening that would mean that each side of the door would have 14 pieces making up the casing?
Could you show us a picture of that?
Rich
I'd be happy to show some pictures, I just figured out how to load pictures into this forum. Hopefully I can do it tomorrow, I did'nt figure my claim would go un-question.
I just spent the last 10 years making the millwork for my home & will be proud to show it off to all my friends here.
Oh you mentioned 14 pcs per side. Please re read, I said 35-50 per side that would be 70-100 per opening. Now this is not every opening some have as few as 11 pcs per side some have fewer some have many more, I treated most openings differently but it all ties together, you'll see, My front door alone has 40 individual pcs around it.
I was going to start posting pictures of the project a year ago to help me get full ambition to complete it but the pictures posting thing was getting under my skin.
I will post it in the "Photo Gallery" with a tilte like "Ten years in the making"
I think you will be suprised at the details & yes there is still a punch list!
Paul No one should regard themselve as "God's gift to man." But rather a mere man whos gifts are from God.
Paul
I am looking forward to the pics.
I love to make unique trim too.
Mostly just make money now though.
Rich
Hi Cargin,
Today was to be picture day but it turned into, Wife takes down Christmas day & if the house isn't clean no one comes over, or the pictures don't go out. LOL.
Also I found the Photo Bucket web site & am setting up my account, looks pretty interesting & should make a good presentation.
Looking to post very soon.
Paul
No one should regard themselve as "God's gift to man." But rather a mere man whos gifts are from God.
Edited 1/2/2008 10:30 pm ET by CardiacPaul
What kind of condensation? On the glass edges? In the glass center?
Just curious.
Bottom edges, although I did have one window with the tell tale oval in the center & Anderson replaced that one. That being said I had a few others with the center ovals & now they don't appear anymore & I can't remeber witch ones they were. No one should regard themselve as "God's gift to man." But rather a mere man whos gifts are from God.
Center ovals indicate collapsed glass. Do a search here there is lots of info. Chances are if you have some you have more, the oval only shows when the glass panes touch. Check your glass for bring concave, if they are, call Andersen and they will fix for free... your in the last year of your warrenty.
Like I said the moisture ovals don't appear anymore and I realize I'm in the last year of the warranty, How would I check for the glass collapse perhaps a straight edge held across the surface of the glass?
I do remember some of the windows with the collapse but not all of them.
Thanks for any help on this one.
Paul
No one should regard themselve as "God's gift to man." But rather a mere man whos gifts are from God.
CardiacPaul,
A couple of houses ago, when I had a forced air heating system, I added a fresh air intake to the return and solved a condensation problem just as you did.
A heating contractor I talked to back then suggested I install a powered damper in the intake and control it with a humidistat.
I didn't, as that would have brought the cost up well over $12, but wouldn't that be a deluxe upgrade? Might save some heating energy too.
Ron
I've been leaving that as a upgrade idea & have a HVAC friend that could set me up real easy, I do have a manual damper & only partially shut it for a few days.
So far, left open this winter it proven to be a good set up.
Paul No one should regard themselve as "God's gift to man." But rather a mere man whos gifts are from God.
Straight edge would be the easiest method.
I have a similar problem and am looking for ideas. I built my house in 1972. The windows are Pella wood windows with a single piece of glass on the exterior and a factory storm panel on the inside. I get lots of condensation between the panels.
Jay
Jay, I think you would have luck with some condensation problems if you tried some of the methods I did, also it sounds like you have a seal failure on the inside storm, its letting moisture migrate to the outer pane of glass.
I have outside storms & they would fog & ice up so bad that I could not see out. This year I only have two of the storms installed, the others are being painted & are not ready to go up, anyway, the two that are up are very clear this year. I believe its the sash weather stripping that I did.
Best of luck to you.
Paul No one should regard themselve as "God's gift to man." But rather a mere man whos gifts are from God.
Jay I have Pella casement windows and had the same problem, there are vent holes on the sides between the inside storm and the outside pane the holes get plugged up from small bees. I use a small screwdriver to clean them out. Remove the the inside storm to gain access to the vent holes. Good Luck Red
Red:
I know what you are talking about. I cleaned the breathing holes out and put a little piece of steel wool in them to keep the critters from using the holes as home. I am wondering if there is a way to retrofit those windows without replacing the whole unit. Thanks Jay
Jay I did a retro on my casements, in the 90's pella changed to a plastic round insert that has a fin like screen on the end that keeps critters out, but does'nt restrict air movement. The good news is it works, bad news is it a little involved. I got the inserts from a Pella Dealer not a Big Box Store. Anyway here is what I did. Remove the steel insert by putting a straight pin punch inside the insert and wobble it around the insert should loosen up and come out. Then I took a Kreg Pocket Hole step drill to enlarge the hole, the small dia. of the drill is the same as hole in the sash and acts as a guide, the large dia. of the drill is the same as the new plastic inserts. With my casements I opened so I would'nt hit the jams. With the fixed windows I finished the holes with a brad point drill bit very very carefully :) So if you give it a try I would take the sashes out to drill em. Hope This Helps Red
Sounds like a good summer project. Thanks for the imput Jay
CardiacPaul,
I take it you didn't add a HRV?
It would be imposible to track how those changes help with your heating bills.. because you are both tightening up and opening up the house. Ducting inside air out from the kitchen and bathroom both.. while doing a better job of sealing up some locations of incoming air.
What you did to your furnace is a version of what the new high efficency furnaces do.. its not as efficent but it is an improvement..
I'm glad you've delt with the moisture issues but I suspect that a similar effect could be achieved with a good HRV and high efficency furnace..
Frechy,
A HRV unit would be the best answer by far, I agree. The only problem I had with that is the old famous "budget"
I had a energy audit on my house after the upgrades & was told my house is still to tight. The furnace is a Carrier SX58 with external combustion & was tested out a 94% efficient.
I was concerned about energy bills & comfort levels in the house but have not proven to be effected. The only times it gets cooler is when I'm only running the main fan in the furnace by itself, drawing in the cold outside air.
I also have a direct vent gas fireplace with concealed combustion chamber that puts out so much heat it feels like a hot summer day in the house, My unit is a Fireplace Xtrordinair by Travis Industries which has three power vents, the main one that recirculates the air in the room with a speed control from zero on up, a 2nd. power vent that dumps hot air into the finished basement & a 3rd. power vent that dumps heat into the furnace cold air return trunk.
On Christmas with the Fireplace burning for a few short times during the evening, 15 people in the house, furnace off, cold air intake power vent on & 80% of the first floor windows open, the house held at 74.
All that being said I believe my energy bills are staying in check.. No one should regard themselve as "God's gift to man." But rather a mere man whos gifts are from God.
I had a couple questions about number 3. How big a duct did you run, 4"? How long a run? Do you open the damper at certain times, like temperature drops? Any problems with putting cold air into the furnace?
I think I had a 8 or 10 foot long pc laying around & kind of looped it to help temper the incoming air. As for the damper I only partially closed it for a day or two of real cold temps. So far I've not had any condisation problems with my ducting or furnace.
We have had a lot of pretty cold ouside temps this year, a lot of single digits at night.
Paul No one should regard themselve as "God's gift to man." But rather a mere man whos gifts are from God.